1 00:00:22,170 --> 00:00:09,100 welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast 2 00:00:29,170 --> 00:00:24,550 hello and welcome to the skeptics on 3 00:00:32,409 --> 00:00:29,180 podcast episode number 422 for the 4 00:00:34,500 --> 00:00:32,419 twentieth of November 2016 Richardson is 5 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:34,510 here with you from McGee McGee McGee 6 00:00:39,849 --> 00:00:37,370 overcast and muggy Sydney Australia 7 00:00:42,340 --> 00:00:39,859 coming up on this week's show another in 8 00:00:45,819 --> 00:00:42,350 the series of interviews from Iran segev 9 00:00:48,900 --> 00:00:45,829 who's lucky enough to go to the QED 10 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:48,910 convention question explore discover and 11 00:00:56,799 --> 00:00:52,850 this week Iran catches up with Alice 12 00:00:59,349 --> 00:00:56,809 howarth and mike hall from the skeptics 13 00:01:01,649 --> 00:00:59,359 with the k podcast one of my favorite 14 00:01:05,079 --> 00:01:01,659 podcasts coming out of liverpool 15 00:01:06,700 --> 00:01:05,089 skeptics with a K and so this week we'll 16 00:01:10,330 --> 00:01:06,710 find out a little bit more about two of 17 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:10,340 the hosts Allison Mike not Michael 18 00:01:15,069 --> 00:01:12,130 Marshall he wasn't there at the time 19 00:01:16,389 --> 00:01:15,079 during the interview at least but I'm 20 00:01:17,980 --> 00:01:16,399 sure you'll find this interview with my 21 00:01:20,859 --> 00:01:17,990 canales very entertaining and 22 00:01:23,319 --> 00:01:20,869 nevertheless in fact as we speak folks 23 00:01:26,380 --> 00:01:23,329 as we speak I think Michael Marshall is 24 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:26,390 getting himself ready to get onto that 25 00:01:31,389 --> 00:01:28,969 flight and not far away to come out here 26 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:31,399 to Australia where he'll be speaking at 27 00:01:35,289 --> 00:01:33,170 the Australian skeptics national 28 00:01:39,670 --> 00:01:35,299 convention of course you all know about 29 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:39,680 that by now in Melbourne coming up next 30 00:01:44,950 --> 00:01:42,530 weekend wow that's coming up quick and 31 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:44,960 I'm sure you'll have a great time there 32 00:01:49,060 --> 00:01:47,210 good news for Sydney people Michael 33 00:01:52,209 --> 00:01:49,070 Marshall will be speaking at skeptics in 34 00:01:54,370 --> 00:01:52,219 the pub on the twenty-ninth of november 35 00:01:57,819 --> 00:01:54,380 and i'll put a link in the show notes or 36 00:02:00,819 --> 00:01:57,829 just join aust skeptics a ust skeptics 37 00:02:04,029 --> 00:02:00,829 on meet up and you'll be sure to a snag 38 00:02:05,919 --> 00:02:04,039 your place skeptics in the pub 29th of 39 00:02:08,109 --> 00:02:05,929 November here in Sydney with Michael 40 00:02:10,389 --> 00:02:08,119 Marshall special guest what else do we 41 00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:10,399 have on this week's show we're going to 42 00:02:15,580 --> 00:02:13,010 delve as a good word I like that word 43 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:15,590 we're going to delve deeply into the 44 00:02:22,110 --> 00:02:18,370 archives of the camber 45 00:02:24,539 --> 00:02:22,120 times the newspaper from Canberra and a 46 00:02:27,660 --> 00:02:24,549 series of reports and letters to the 47 00:02:30,210 --> 00:02:27,670 editor to do with skeptical activities 48 00:02:32,490 --> 00:02:30,220 over 30 years ago now there was a 49 00:02:34,170 --> 00:02:32,500 mind-body wallet type convention in 50 00:02:36,630 --> 00:02:34,180 Canberra many years ago over 30 years 51 00:02:39,990 --> 00:02:36,640 ago the skeptics turned up with big a 52 00:02:41,789 --> 00:02:40,000 big sign saying that they have a prize 53 00:02:43,229 --> 00:02:41,799 of twenty thousand dollars then for 54 00:02:45,479 --> 00:02:43,239 proof of the paranormal they got up the 55 00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:45,489 nose of the people running the new age 56 00:02:51,869 --> 00:02:48,970 festival and newspaper articles and 57 00:02:54,259 --> 00:02:51,879 letters letters to the editor ensued 58 00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:54,269 we're going to be following that little 59 00:02:59,970 --> 00:02:57,090 exercise that little trail that little 60 00:03:02,250 --> 00:02:59,980 series of events from over 30 years ago 61 00:03:04,979 --> 00:03:02,260 and you'll be surprised in a way how 62 00:03:07,110 --> 00:03:04,989 little things have changed how little 63 00:03:08,849 --> 00:03:07,120 things have changed then I'm delighted 64 00:03:11,759 --> 00:03:08,859 to say we have a new segment on the 65 00:03:13,289 --> 00:03:11,769 skeptic zone for those fans of a week 66 00:03:15,660 --> 00:03:13,299 and science that we used to run from the 67 00:03:18,300 --> 00:03:15,670 Royal Institution of Australia we now 68 00:03:20,910 --> 00:03:18,310 have a new segment from Australia's 69 00:03:25,430 --> 00:03:20,920 science channel which is run by the same 70 00:03:29,280 --> 00:03:25,440 people brouhaha this is short science 71 00:03:31,170 --> 00:03:29,290 snippets bits and pieces brouhaha coming 72 00:03:32,970 --> 00:03:31,180 up a little bit later on in the show I'm 73 00:03:37,020 --> 00:03:32,980 sure you'll enjoy that nice concise 74 00:03:39,690 --> 00:03:37,030 little clips snips bits pieces of 75 00:03:41,339 --> 00:03:39,700 science then to round off the show it's 76 00:03:43,259 --> 00:03:41,349 the return of the think tank now 77 00:03:44,670 --> 00:03:43,269 longtime listeners to the skeptic zone 78 00:03:46,949 --> 00:03:44,680 certainly remember the think tank where 79 00:03:48,539 --> 00:03:46,959 we used to run down to our club at the 80 00:03:50,970 --> 00:03:48,549 end of the street in the Chinese 81 00:03:53,069 --> 00:03:50,980 restaurant have a dinner and chat about 82 00:03:56,670 --> 00:03:53,079 skeptical things well this week my old 83 00:03:58,379 --> 00:03:56,680 friend and skeptic longtime skeptic 84 00:04:01,140 --> 00:03:58,389 Steve Roberts he's one of our UFO 85 00:04:03,390 --> 00:04:01,150 experts joins us together with may nod 86 00:04:05,250 --> 00:04:03,400 to discuss UFOs amongst many other 87 00:04:08,610 --> 00:04:05,260 things an old australian mysteries and 88 00:04:11,339 --> 00:04:08,620 water bubbles in clouds and codes and 89 00:04:13,949 --> 00:04:11,349 lots of different weird things so join 90 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:13,959 us later on in the show for the think 91 00:04:19,529 --> 00:04:16,090 tank but now it's time for me to run 92 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:19,539 downstairs have a nice slice of toast 93 00:04:26,580 --> 00:04:24,250 with honey butter yeah yeah okay hot 94 00:04:28,950 --> 00:04:26,590 toast butter let the butter melt into 95 00:04:31,290 --> 00:04:28,960 the toast a little bit lightly spread 96 00:04:33,420 --> 00:04:31,300 with some nice Australian honey 97 00:04:48,890 --> 00:04:33,430 and good afternoon snack while I do that 98 00:05:03,570 --> 00:04:54,720 awesome awesome let's all take this with 99 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:03,580 a grain of salt seas around ticket so i 100 00:05:10,590 --> 00:05:06,010 have allison mike from skeptics with 101 00:05:12,900 --> 00:05:10,600 okay i will start with mike okay because 102 00:05:16,650 --> 00:05:12,910 you're the kind of calm your gun has a 103 00:05:21,930 --> 00:05:16,660 brain behind QED well my brain behind 104 00:05:24,870 --> 00:05:21,940 community prime 3d uh I don't you really 105 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:24,880 exist cute cuties QED is a group project 106 00:05:30,290 --> 00:05:28,090 and we all contribute and it's it's it's 107 00:05:32,730 --> 00:05:30,300 brilliant and it is the product of the 108 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:32,740 fantastic six people who say fantastic 109 00:05:38,310 --> 00:05:34,930 sick people the fantastic five people 110 00:05:41,090 --> 00:05:38,320 and me who work on tastic 6p work on 111 00:05:44,130 --> 00:05:41,100 those at work on QED behind the scenes 112 00:05:48,300 --> 00:05:44,140 it's it's probably not wrong to say that 113 00:05:51,060 --> 00:05:48,310 a reasonable chunk of what cuties about 114 00:05:52,830 --> 00:05:51,070 comes out of my personality of wanting 115 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:52,840 to make sure that everything is just 116 00:05:57,240 --> 00:05:54,250 exactly right which I get endless 117 00:05:59,310 --> 00:05:57,250 amounts of stick for but it turns out 118 00:06:01,200 --> 00:05:59,320 that when we applied to QD works really 119 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:01,210 really well which is which is fantastic 120 00:06:08,610 --> 00:06:05,530 and are you happy I'm I mean it's Sunday 121 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:08,620 night now kad is open I QED finished 122 00:06:13,110 --> 00:06:10,450 about six hours ago a little bit more 123 00:06:15,930 --> 00:06:13,120 than that I'm exhausted I'm not sure how 124 00:06:18,450 --> 00:06:15,940 much sleep I've had but i think the 125 00:06:20,010 --> 00:06:18,460 event went well i think people it seemed 126 00:06:21,690 --> 00:06:20,020 to have gone smoothly people seem to 127 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:21,700 have enjoyed themselves there's a lot of 128 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:23,650 people upstairs in the bar very happy at 129 00:06:26,940 --> 00:06:25,090 the moment and i like there's a lot of 130 00:06:28,620 --> 00:06:26,950 people in this hotel at the moment you 131 00:06:31,230 --> 00:06:28,630 are happy because of stuff that we did 132 00:06:34,380 --> 00:06:31,240 that's brilliant ats that that's made my 133 00:06:36,450 --> 00:06:34,390 weekend excellent because actually that 134 00:06:40,260 --> 00:06:36,460 is the measure of success isn't it that 135 00:06:42,870 --> 00:06:40,270 you have 666 people who came here yeah a 136 00:06:43,820 --> 00:06:42,880 very appropriately and magnin something 137 00:06:46,100 --> 00:06:43,830 we didn't win 138 00:06:48,650 --> 00:06:46,110 that's just how it worked out which was 139 00:06:51,740 --> 00:06:48,660 brilliant but yeah we've we've had a 140 00:06:55,220 --> 00:06:51,750 load of people that came down 666 people 141 00:06:57,620 --> 00:06:55,230 as you say and you know they've left 142 00:06:59,360 --> 00:06:57,630 very happy as best we can tell and 143 00:07:01,520 --> 00:06:59,370 that's that's that's the goal we're not 144 00:07:02,930 --> 00:07:01,530 looking at taking people who believe in 145 00:07:04,940 --> 00:07:02,940 pseudoscience are trying to change their 146 00:07:07,100 --> 00:07:04,950 mind that's not really what QED is about 147 00:07:09,530 --> 00:07:07,110 we like to challenge our audience but 148 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:09,540 really it is a skeptic event for a 149 00:07:15,470 --> 00:07:11,490 skeptical audience you could argue that 150 00:07:16,940 --> 00:07:15,480 it's preaching to the choir but it's 151 00:07:19,940 --> 00:07:16,950 more about celebrating the fact that 152 00:07:21,740 --> 00:07:19,950 there is a choir and we're not so always 153 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:21,750 says I'm sure a lot of skeptics felt 154 00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:23,850 before they discovered the skeptical 155 00:07:27,110 --> 00:07:26,010 community that there was that they were 156 00:07:29,030 --> 00:07:27,120 the only people who thought like this 157 00:07:31,790 --> 00:07:29,040 that they go really is the whole of the 158 00:07:33,380 --> 00:07:31,800 rest of the world it up Tilly irrational 159 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:33,390 and doesn't see how much nonsense this 160 00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:35,490 is and then suddenly discover this 161 00:07:38,480 --> 00:07:36,690 community and there's all these other 162 00:07:41,330 --> 00:07:38,490 people who think the same way you do and 163 00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:41,340 the it you're not a soloist anymore you 164 00:07:46,790 --> 00:07:43,890 are in the choir the fact that there is 165 00:07:48,410 --> 00:07:46,800 a choir is brilliant and that's that's 166 00:07:50,060 --> 00:07:48,420 something to celebrate that's something 167 00:07:51,620 --> 00:07:50,070 that we have so preaching to the choir I 168 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:51,630 don't care it's brilliant that there is 169 00:07:55,100 --> 00:07:53,370 a quiet and that we're going to you know 170 00:07:58,580 --> 00:07:55,110 have fun with the fact that this 171 00:08:01,430 --> 00:07:58,590 community even exists if I may add just 172 00:08:04,340 --> 00:08:01,440 that I don't think that we're preaching 173 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:04,350 in these kind of evolved so the point is 174 00:08:08,900 --> 00:08:07,050 it's it's something that we energizes 175 00:08:10,910 --> 00:08:08,910 people and it makes them feel part of 176 00:08:14,030 --> 00:08:10,920 something and I think that is hugely 177 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:14,040 important obviously myself organized 178 00:08:18,530 --> 00:08:16,890 some conferences yeah and I've heard 179 00:08:21,260 --> 00:08:18,540 this criticism about preaching to the 180 00:08:24,020 --> 00:08:21,270 choir but it's neither preaching nor is 181 00:08:27,020 --> 00:08:24,030 it the goal of this is this kind of 182 00:08:29,030 --> 00:08:27,030 event it is really a social event and 183 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:29,040 it's a time for people to meet other you 184 00:08:33,050 --> 00:08:30,930 know it's a networking event yeah and 185 00:08:35,300 --> 00:08:33,060 it's just time for people to to be 186 00:08:36,740 --> 00:08:35,310 together and as you say within either 187 00:08:40,100 --> 00:08:36,750 celebrate the fact that there is a choir 188 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:40,110 but not in the normal context of what we 189 00:08:43,820 --> 00:08:42,330 think of it yeah yeah and and we do like 190 00:08:45,650 --> 00:08:43,830 to challenge the audience we like to put 191 00:08:47,950 --> 00:08:45,660 material on there that's going to push 192 00:08:50,930 --> 00:08:47,960 them and make them think and make them 193 00:08:52,550 --> 00:08:50,940 consider ideas in new ways but that's 194 00:08:54,980 --> 00:08:52,560 within the context of what we already 195 00:08:57,620 --> 00:08:54,990 agree on which is the evidence-based 196 00:08:58,640 --> 00:08:57,630 approach but if we can sneak around 197 00:09:00,290 --> 00:08:58,650 find you and tap you on the shoulder 198 00:09:01,610 --> 00:09:00,300 guard but you didn't think about this 199 00:09:03,620 --> 00:09:01,620 thing from an evidence-based approach 200 00:09:05,150 --> 00:09:03,630 did you and people got oh yeah that's 201 00:09:07,310 --> 00:09:05,160 that's right i need to start thinking 202 00:09:09,830 --> 00:09:07,320 about that and improving and being a 203 00:09:11,780 --> 00:09:09,840 better a better skeptic and a better 204 00:09:15,890 --> 00:09:11,790 person that's that's brilliant if we can 205 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:15,900 do that now speaking of you know 206 00:09:20,150 --> 00:09:18,210 speaking speaking to the choir I want to 207 00:09:22,690 --> 00:09:20,160 speak a little bit of skeptics with okay 208 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:22,700 okay so how long does it being angular 209 00:09:27,380 --> 00:09:25,290 seven years I think now just over seven 210 00:09:29,210 --> 00:09:27,390 years we've been going 2000-2009 we 211 00:09:32,810 --> 00:09:29,220 started august august two thousand nine 212 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:32,820 that is a while so we've heard mostly a 213 00:09:37,490 --> 00:09:35,130 voice till now and but two and a half 214 00:09:42,290 --> 00:09:37,500 years ago the week before QED two and a 215 00:09:46,030 --> 00:09:42,300 half years ago calling made the mistake 216 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:46,040 of deciding to have children I'm and 217 00:09:52,250 --> 00:09:49,530 I've met Collins children a torch always 218 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:52,260 child ended at the moment I don't know 219 00:10:03,680 --> 00:09:54,890 where else that's going on and lovely 220 00:10:05,810 --> 00:10:03,690 lovely yeah Cullen oh you're tired so 221 00:10:08,300 --> 00:10:05,820 and and alice is the delightful 222 00:10:10,250 --> 00:10:08,310 replacement for calling very different 223 00:10:12,380 --> 00:10:10,260 Cullen yeah I'm similar in a lot of way 224 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:12,390 yeah well first of all you're a 225 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:15,090 scientist I am a scientist yeah almost 226 00:10:20,690 --> 00:10:19,050 BHD almost PhD yeah I've always been 227 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:20,700 passionate about science and that's kind 228 00:10:26,110 --> 00:10:22,650 of why try and bring to the show is my 229 00:10:28,310 --> 00:10:26,120 enthusiasm for science much too Martius 230 00:10:31,130 --> 00:10:28,320 she go and I think and I think he loves 231 00:10:33,740 --> 00:10:31,140 it but out of the same so that's that's 232 00:10:36,740 --> 00:10:33,750 the important thing right I actually you 233 00:10:39,230 --> 00:10:36,750 know as a listener I think he does love 234 00:10:41,540 --> 00:10:39,240 it I he just got here I take I take the 235 00:10:44,270 --> 00:10:41,550 piss that much doesn't like science but 236 00:10:46,190 --> 00:10:44,280 he I think he does like science really i 237 00:10:48,830 --> 00:10:46,200 think just like the very detailed 238 00:10:50,930 --> 00:10:48,840 details that i like I think I think he 239 00:10:52,460 --> 00:10:50,940 resents the fact that he can't make puns 240 00:10:54,530 --> 00:10:52,470 about some of the things that you talk 241 00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:54,540 about but I wasn't that well it's a team 242 00:10:58,460 --> 00:10:56,490 complicated yeah that's the thing tons 243 00:11:00,410 --> 00:10:58,470 of help yeah but I think other than that 244 00:11:03,860 --> 00:11:00,420 he loves it I think you like the place 245 00:11:06,010 --> 00:11:03,870 yeah he's read most my thesis is quite 246 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:06,020 impressive for somebody who hate science 247 00:11:09,630 --> 00:11:08,730 he's read most of his my advice my 248 00:11:13,590 --> 00:11:09,640 thesis because 249 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:13,600 Marsh is a very good writer and so as 250 00:11:17,670 --> 00:11:15,010 I've been writing my thesis he offered 251 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:17,680 to to proofread bits of my thesis and so 252 00:11:21,990 --> 00:11:19,810 I've sent him all of my results chapters 253 00:11:24,150 --> 00:11:22,000 most of my introduction and he's read 254 00:11:26,340 --> 00:11:24,160 through most of it and proof read it and 255 00:11:28,950 --> 00:11:26,350 giving me corrections on not necessarily 256 00:11:32,070 --> 00:11:28,960 our science but but on me on the grammar 257 00:11:33,180 --> 00:11:32,080 and the writing and how to improve how 258 00:11:36,900 --> 00:11:33,190 I'm presenting the work that I'm doing 259 00:11:42,630 --> 00:11:36,910 so that is quite admirable it is first 260 00:11:44,670 --> 00:11:42,640 someone who hate science yeah so what do 261 00:11:46,830 --> 00:11:44,680 you have any any plans for any anything 262 00:11:48,510 --> 00:11:46,840 different that you're planning to do are 263 00:11:50,550 --> 00:11:48,520 you just going to continue doing what 264 00:11:52,530 --> 00:11:50,560 you've been doing with skeptics with a k 265 00:11:54,410 --> 00:11:52,540 well we're probably going to you know 266 00:11:57,720 --> 00:11:54,420 keep doing what we're doing we do have 267 00:12:00,300 --> 00:11:57,730 this idea of the the day Alice hands a 268 00:12:02,460 --> 00:12:00,310 thesis end of doing a an episode where 269 00:12:04,350 --> 00:12:02,470 drunken saying it Allison Marsh you're 270 00:12:06,990 --> 00:12:04,360 going to get completely drunk in a 271 00:12:10,650 --> 00:12:07,000 massive massive display of irresponsible 272 00:12:12,660 --> 00:12:10,660 behavior I won't be participating in the 273 00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:12,670 drunkenness cuz I'm teetotal and have 274 00:12:19,230 --> 00:12:16,210 been like forever but I can sit there 275 00:12:22,770 --> 00:12:19,240 and observe March and Allison yeah cuz 276 00:12:24,660 --> 00:12:22,780 you love seeing as dress there'll be an 277 00:12:26,940 --> 00:12:24,670 interesting episode but no we're going 278 00:12:29,790 --> 00:12:26,950 to keep doing the things that we know 279 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:29,800 have to do which is you know make fun of 280 00:12:33,210 --> 00:12:31,450 silly things that we see happen in the 281 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:33,220 news sometimes we'll sit there and get 282 00:12:37,740 --> 00:12:34,810 indignant and angry about a serious 283 00:12:39,750 --> 00:12:37,750 point but the show's really is the show 284 00:12:41,940 --> 00:12:39,760 is conversations that we would be having 285 00:12:44,610 --> 00:12:41,950 any way we just stick a microphone in 286 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:44,620 the middle before we have them so that 287 00:12:48,270 --> 00:12:46,090 the show is going to be what the show is 288 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:48,280 going to be will see that the tone is 289 00:12:52,680 --> 00:12:50,290 going to change and evolve as we do um 290 00:12:55,110 --> 00:12:52,690 times it ruins our actual conversations 291 00:12:57,930 --> 00:12:55,120 in the pub because we'll start having a 292 00:13:00,210 --> 00:12:57,940 conversation in the pub me Martian Mike 293 00:13:01,940 --> 00:13:00,220 and Mike usually is the one to say no 294 00:13:04,680 --> 00:13:01,950 let's leave it for the show's over 295 00:13:06,240 --> 00:13:04,690 station we should be having sleazy and 296 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:06,250 up for fun we should save it for the 297 00:13:09,270 --> 00:13:07,930 show that listeners a little bit we had 298 00:13:10,740 --> 00:13:09,280 a very long conversation at the 299 00:13:12,180 --> 00:13:10,750 Edinburgh Festival about two o'clock in 300 00:13:14,130 --> 00:13:12,190 the morning where you were drunk and 301 00:13:17,270 --> 00:13:14,140 marsh recession country Joan 302 00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:17,280 his birthday about about whether 303 00:13:23,250 --> 00:13:20,290 decapitating a footballer while trying 304 00:13:25,680 --> 00:13:23,260 to when actually playing for the ball if 305 00:13:29,070 --> 00:13:25,690 you could decapitate the football is 306 00:13:31,350 --> 00:13:29,080 that a foul that was a long long 307 00:13:33,450 --> 00:13:31,360 conversation that when I'm much longer 308 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:33,460 than needed to I need to be such I look 309 00:13:41,550 --> 00:13:36,970 as it as a huge football fan right I 310 00:13:43,050 --> 00:13:41,560 must say that my question would be which 311 00:13:49,620 --> 00:13:43,060 football because some footballs could 312 00:13:51,480 --> 00:13:49,630 obviously live without their we didn't 313 00:13:54,330 --> 00:13:51,490 get on to that part of the topic I don't 314 00:13:56,250 --> 00:13:54,340 think no we did get as far as them pre 315 00:13:58,470 --> 00:13:56,260 perforating their necks before they came 316 00:14:00,690 --> 00:13:58,480 out on that in order to make it 317 00:14:04,260 --> 00:14:00,700 easier for the head to come off doesn't 318 00:14:06,090 --> 00:14:04,270 work that way decoration actually makes 319 00:14:07,590 --> 00:14:06,100 it stronger don't you know have you ever 320 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:07,600 seen toilet paper ever tear along the 321 00:14:11,220 --> 00:14:09,970 perforation I mean then what do you 322 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:11,230 think the perforation lines at the 323 00:14:16,050 --> 00:14:13,090 bottom of a postage stamp or four that's 324 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:16,060 four that's four peeling off the the 325 00:14:22,350 --> 00:14:18,730 perforations on the Queen's neck that's 326 00:14:24,140 --> 00:14:22,360 what that's about so yeah so we have 327 00:14:26,940 --> 00:14:24,150 some ridiculous conversations in person 328 00:14:29,070 --> 00:14:26,950 and every soften stick a microphone in 329 00:14:30,450 --> 00:14:29,080 the middle and and have those 330 00:14:31,740 --> 00:14:30,460 conversations on it and we're going to 331 00:14:34,530 --> 00:14:31,750 keep doing that because it's what is 332 00:14:35,970 --> 00:14:34,540 what we enjoy doing with the time we're 333 00:14:38,670 --> 00:14:35,980 going to stop doing the show is the time 334 00:14:40,590 --> 00:14:38,680 we're not enjoying it anymore so you're 335 00:14:42,870 --> 00:14:40,600 going to continue doing this very very 336 00:14:44,850 --> 00:14:42,880 long time okay that's very good to know 337 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:44,860 okay thank you very much and 338 00:15:03,480 --> 00:14:46,810 congratulations on a great conference 339 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:06,670 CS top simple idiot hey Sal who guys 340 00:15:10,690 --> 00:15:08,690 guys I just had the most amazing 341 00:15:12,490 --> 00:15:10,700 experience what experience under us 342 00:15:14,199 --> 00:15:12,500 under have you been to the pub I told 343 00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:14,209 you not to hang out with mash you know 344 00:15:19,389 --> 00:15:16,850 he was blessed by peter Popoff no yellow 345 00:15:21,940 --> 00:15:19,399 no i'm not talking about psychics it was 346 00:15:23,590 --> 00:15:21,950 a really SP experience now you have been 347 00:15:26,470 --> 00:15:23,600 to the pub either that or you've been 348 00:15:28,900 --> 00:15:26,480 smoking something no pointers the ESB is 349 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:28,910 the European skeptics podcast it's the 350 00:15:33,130 --> 00:15:31,010 most amazing thing you get to know so 351 00:15:35,980 --> 00:15:33,140 much about skeptics and their activities 352 00:15:38,110 --> 00:15:35,990 across Europe you know event hot topics 353 00:15:40,300 --> 00:15:38,120 and interviews with lots of interesting 354 00:15:42,069 --> 00:15:40,310 people oh wow cool by the way pointers 355 00:15:44,470 --> 00:15:42,079 you just committed the false dichotomy 356 00:15:47,319 --> 00:15:44,480 fallacy I guess that means I'm really 357 00:15:49,329 --> 00:15:47,329 wrong yep and you can even learn about 358 00:15:51,790 --> 00:15:49,339 those fallacies in the show and hear 359 00:15:54,100 --> 00:15:51,800 about people spreading silly ideas you 360 00:15:57,069 --> 00:15:54,110 should really check it out it's the ESP 361 00:15:59,769 --> 00:15:57,079 the European skeptics podcast its own 362 00:16:02,110 --> 00:15:59,779 never weak alright so where can I get 363 00:16:04,780 --> 00:16:02,120 this is the experience it sounds good 364 00:16:08,050 --> 00:16:04,790 you can go online at the ESP door to you 365 00:16:10,870 --> 00:16:08,060 follow it on twitter at es podcast and 366 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:10,880 the score EU or like the podcast on 367 00:16:16,060 --> 00:16:13,010 facebook oh and you can also contact the 368 00:16:19,900 --> 00:16:16,070 show by sending them an email to info at 369 00:16:21,940 --> 00:16:19,910 the ESPE you and if you want to 370 00:16:24,699 --> 00:16:21,950 subscribe do a quick search for the 371 00:16:30,699 --> 00:16:24,709 european skeptic podcast on soundcloud 372 00:16:47,970 --> 00:16:30,709 itunes or stitcher I don't know why you 373 00:16:54,519 --> 00:16:50,380 recently I was asked to look into some 374 00:16:57,220 --> 00:16:54,529 old paranormal cases here in Australia 375 00:17:01,030 --> 00:16:57,230 one of them being the Humpty do ghosts 376 00:17:05,290 --> 00:17:01,040 poltergeists from 1998 and the other 377 00:17:08,140 --> 00:17:05,300 being the Knowles family UFO attack on 378 00:17:12,220 --> 00:17:08,150 the Nullarbor plain way back in nineteen 379 00:17:14,380 --> 00:17:12,230 eighty-eight and I owe you a little 380 00:17:17,350 --> 00:17:14,390 about both of these situations both of 381 00:17:19,829 --> 00:17:17,360 these stories these cases but I spent a 382 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:19,839 couple of days doing a lot of research 383 00:17:27,100 --> 00:17:22,970 and I must say the best the best 384 00:17:29,140 --> 00:17:27,110 information I gleaned from the internet 385 00:17:31,150 --> 00:17:29,150 on both these cases came from the pages 386 00:17:34,450 --> 00:17:31,160 of the Australian skeptics magazine the 387 00:17:36,730 --> 00:17:34,460 skeptic through the online search and 388 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:36,740 PDFs available at skeptics calm today 389 00:17:41,050 --> 00:17:38,570 you now I often mention this but it's 390 00:17:43,210 --> 00:17:41,060 true and the wealth of information from 391 00:17:46,419 --> 00:17:43,220 the pages of this journal it's quite 392 00:17:48,730 --> 00:17:46,429 impressive the skeptics at the time did 393 00:17:51,790 --> 00:17:48,740 a lot of work a lot of work and wrote 394 00:17:55,950 --> 00:17:51,800 very comprehensive reports but during 395 00:17:59,260 --> 00:17:55,960 general investigations and searches I 396 00:18:01,270 --> 00:17:59,270 took advantage of a website and if 397 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:01,280 you're in Australia you might not know 398 00:18:09,030 --> 00:18:03,290 or maybe you do know this website it's 399 00:18:14,350 --> 00:18:09,040 called trove and the URL is trove in LA 400 00:18:17,610 --> 00:18:14,360 gov au and it's a wonderful collection 401 00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:17,620 of digitized newspapers and journals 402 00:18:26,140 --> 00:18:21,170 going back many years in fact it says 403 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:26,150 find and get over 518 million two 404 00:18:32,230 --> 00:18:29,810 hundred and ninety 2042 Australian and 405 00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:32,240 online resources books images historic 406 00:18:37,360 --> 00:18:34,490 newspapers maps music archives and more 407 00:18:39,220 --> 00:18:37,370 it's worth a look and during my searches 408 00:18:41,080 --> 00:18:39,230 and investigations using this page I 409 00:18:44,650 --> 00:18:41,090 came across an interesting chain of 410 00:18:46,790 --> 00:18:44,660 events that took place over 30 years ago 411 00:18:50,510 --> 00:18:46,800 in Canberra 412 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:50,520 where there was a a new age festival way 413 00:18:55,640 --> 00:18:53,490 back in nineteen eighty six and first I 414 00:18:57,710 --> 00:18:55,650 discovered a reply a letter to the 415 00:19:00,500 --> 00:18:57,720 editor talking about a previous letter 416 00:19:02,150 --> 00:19:00,510 to the editor I trace that back and I 417 00:19:03,740 --> 00:19:02,160 traced back the original report what 418 00:19:06,260 --> 00:19:03,750 happened was there is a new age festival 419 00:19:09,290 --> 00:19:06,270 and the local skeptics from Canberra at 420 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:09,300 the time turned up with a car with a 421 00:19:12,770 --> 00:19:11,250 huge sign on it offering a 422 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:12,780 twenty-thousand-dollar reward for 423 00:19:18,650 --> 00:19:16,290 paranormal proof of the paranormal this 424 00:19:22,370 --> 00:19:18,660 got up the nose of the organizer as you 425 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:22,380 can imagine the the skeptics had a right 426 00:19:26,780 --> 00:19:24,330 of reply to the editor a little while 427 00:19:29,540 --> 00:19:26,790 later and then somebody replied to the 428 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:29,550 skeptic so what I thought I'd do I found 429 00:19:34,390 --> 00:19:31,290 it quite a fascinating little story what 430 00:19:39,020 --> 00:19:34,400 I thought I'd do is I'd relate these 431 00:19:42,290 --> 00:19:39,030 reports to you so we start with the 432 00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:42,300 first report and this comes from the 433 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:45,210 Canberra Times newspaper dated Sunday 434 00:19:59,560 --> 00:19:54,540 healers suggest a festival for skeptics 435 00:20:02,440 --> 00:19:59,570 by James Gordon quote if the skeptics 436 00:20:04,810 --> 00:20:02,450 Association wants to promote a view then 437 00:20:07,810 --> 00:20:04,820 let them run a festival for skepticism 438 00:20:10,030 --> 00:20:07,820 and quote mr. rod Roach organizer of the 439 00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:10,040 second camera alternative medicine and 440 00:20:15,340 --> 00:20:13,490 ESP festival said yesterday quote I will 441 00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:15,350 not permit them to ride on the back of 442 00:20:20,230 --> 00:20:17,810 our publicity people here have paid a 443 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:20,240 lot of money to promote their ideas and 444 00:20:25,210 --> 00:20:23,330 feelings end quote the festival is being 445 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:25,220 held at the diplomat international 446 00:20:29,980 --> 00:20:27,410 Griffith the grandeur of which is 447 00:20:32,590 --> 00:20:29,990 complimented by the capara of the 448 00:20:35,470 --> 00:20:32,600 Russian Orthodox Church of st. John the 449 00:20:37,900 --> 00:20:35,480 Baptist rising behind it as you approach 450 00:20:40,570 --> 00:20:37,910 the entrance where there is a car man by 451 00:20:42,490 --> 00:20:40,580 the Canberra skeptics with a sign on top 452 00:20:45,100 --> 00:20:42,500 offering twenty thousand dollar reward 453 00:20:47,710 --> 00:20:45,110 for just one proven psychic occurrence 454 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:47,720 you are welcomed by a young man in a 455 00:20:53,380 --> 00:20:50,570 black tie you walk up the red carpet 456 00:20:56,530 --> 00:20:53,390 into a palace of brass rails and thick 457 00:20:59,710 --> 00:20:56,540 red guide ropes mr. rope said the plush 458 00:21:01,750 --> 00:20:59,720 hotel had been chosen so quote the 459 00:21:05,050 --> 00:21:01,760 public can see that the people here are 460 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:05,060 reputable people men quote quote I mean 461 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:06,770 to say they pay a heck of a lot of money 462 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:11,090 to come and do this and quote he said it 463 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:13,610 was hard to imagine a skeptics vessel 464 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:17,210 here now quartz crystal balls no fashion 465 00:21:22,770 --> 00:21:19,970 parade of clothes to show off auras no 466 00:21:25,420 --> 00:21:22,780 quote Rescue Remedy men quote for quote 467 00:21:27,940 --> 00:21:25,430 emergencies EG accidents shocks 468 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:27,950 unconsciousness fainting emotional upset 469 00:21:34,450 --> 00:21:31,850 sorrow bad news etc end quote for just 470 00:21:37,390 --> 00:21:34,460 quote five dollars per bottle main 471 00:21:39,190 --> 00:21:37,400 quarter perhaps just gloomy types in 472 00:21:41,620 --> 00:21:39,200 gray suits behind the public service 473 00:21:44,110 --> 00:21:41,630 surplus desks if you had been working 474 00:21:46,090 --> 00:21:44,120 hard enough to get RS I surely there 475 00:21:48,970 --> 00:21:46,100 would be no harm in a small bottle of 476 00:21:50,980 --> 00:21:48,980 Bach flower remedy mr. roat City 477 00:21:54,130 --> 00:21:50,990 understood that the verification 478 00:21:56,740 --> 00:21:54,140 proposed by the skeptics was quote so 479 00:21:59,800 --> 00:21:56,750 controlled that they can't get a result 480 00:22:03,100 --> 00:21:59,810 anyway unquote his wife and youngest son 481 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:03,110 fire walked and had they known the 482 00:22:06,090 --> 00:22:04,450 skeptics were going to be there 483 00:22:09,060 --> 00:22:06,100 they would have given a demonstration 484 00:22:12,510 --> 00:22:09,070 and quote you can't fake that one end 485 00:22:14,420 --> 00:22:12,520 quote in the 23 or so rooms used for 486 00:22:17,190 --> 00:22:14,430 demonstrations there were only 487 00:22:19,500 --> 00:22:17,200 professional dedicated people who did 488 00:22:22,500 --> 00:22:19,510 not quote fall into the category of 489 00:22:23,790 --> 00:22:22,510 trying something on and quote asked to 490 00:22:26,550 --> 00:22:23,800 describe the difference between a 491 00:22:29,970 --> 00:22:26,560 professional and a charlatan he said 492 00:22:33,270 --> 00:22:29,980 quote charlatans dot dot dot I don't 493 00:22:35,310 --> 00:22:33,280 know what they are and quote he quoted a 494 00:22:37,410 --> 00:22:35,320 university teacher of conventional 495 00:22:39,210 --> 00:22:37,420 Australian medicine as saying that 496 00:22:41,250 --> 00:22:39,220 eighty-five percent of illness was 497 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:41,260 self-limiting and the biggest thing 498 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:43,690 about alternative healers was that they 499 00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:45,970 had the time to care for the person 500 00:22:50,010 --> 00:22:47,890 while the correction were not 501 00:22:52,500 --> 00:22:50,020 traditional medicine could not hold the 502 00:22:56,220 --> 00:22:52,510 patient's hand for an hour once a week 503 00:22:58,320 --> 00:22:56,230 for three months he and his wife Joan 504 00:23:00,510 --> 00:22:58,330 charged thirty dollars for the first 505 00:23:03,090 --> 00:23:00,520 consultation which was one and a half 506 00:23:05,970 --> 00:23:03,100 hours and twenty dollars for hour-long 507 00:23:07,350 --> 00:23:05,980 follow-ups he was thinking it really 508 00:23:10,410 --> 00:23:07,360 should be twenty-five dollars an hour 509 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:10,420 quote we can give them the tender loving 510 00:23:16,740 --> 00:23:13,090 care they need and quote he said quote 511 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:16,750 it may be just sitting over a table and 512 00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:19,450 chatting and showing your caring person 513 00:23:24,090 --> 00:23:22,210 end quote at least seven people at the 514 00:23:26,700 --> 00:23:24,100 festival could cure eight out of ten 515 00:23:29,460 --> 00:23:26,710 headaches within ten minutes with such 516 00:23:31,890 --> 00:23:29,470 treatments as herbal remedies massage & 517 00:23:33,990 --> 00:23:31,900 relaxation such treatment stirred the 518 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:34,000 patient's confidence but it was only a 519 00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:37,330 quote band-aid cure and quote illness 520 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:39,610 was caused by something wrong with the 521 00:23:45,900 --> 00:23:42,490 person's thinking and the therapist had 522 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:45,910 to touch the cause the whole being the 523 00:23:50,190 --> 00:23:48,490 physical mental and spiritual quote our 524 00:23:53,010 --> 00:23:50,200 job in alternative medicine is not 525 00:23:55,590 --> 00:23:53,020 really to fix it is the show the person 526 00:23:57,870 --> 00:23:55,600 the pathway along which if they take it 527 00:24:00,600 --> 00:23:57,880 they'll fix themselves my understanding 528 00:24:03,060 --> 00:24:00,610 is that a lot of people that jesus 529 00:24:06,090 --> 00:24:03,070 healed in fact later took on the same 530 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:06,100 problem again end quote he had quote 531 00:24:11,820 --> 00:24:10,090 given them a quick zap pen quote quote 532 00:24:14,490 --> 00:24:11,830 their symptoms went bang immediately 533 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:14,500 because he was the very best healer we 534 00:24:18,860 --> 00:24:16,050 have ever had 535 00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:18,870 dot dot dot but Jesus can't change that 536 00:24:23,120 --> 00:24:21,210 thinking they've got their own free will 537 00:24:24,860 --> 00:24:23,130 and they've had the opportunity to 538 00:24:27,710 --> 00:24:24,870 change their thinking but they didn't 539 00:24:30,140 --> 00:24:27,720 all choose it end quote the festival is 540 00:24:34,100 --> 00:24:30,150 open from ten a.m. to five p.m. today 541 00:24:36,890 --> 00:24:34,110 and the article provides a picture Jen 542 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:36,900 Ludden of redhill a member of the roach 543 00:24:42,530 --> 00:24:40,050 clinic performs kinesiology on mrs. 544 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:42,540 Nanette droski of O'Connor at the 545 00:24:47,180 --> 00:24:44,970 diplomat international yesterday and 546 00:24:49,460 --> 00:24:47,190 another picture accompanying the article 547 00:24:52,820 --> 00:24:49,470 is a picture of two skeptics with the 548 00:24:54,610 --> 00:24:52,830 big sign on top of a car reward $20,000 549 00:24:57,470 --> 00:24:54,620 for genuine paranormal phenomenon 550 00:25:00,800 --> 00:24:57,480 Canberra skeptics members mr. Simon 551 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:00,810 Brown left and mr. guy McClendon both of 552 00:25:10,159 --> 00:25:02,610 Turner outside the diplomat 553 00:25:18,109 --> 00:25:13,469 in reply to this report we have a letter 554 00:25:26,470 --> 00:25:18,119 to the editor dated Tuesday may the 27th 555 00:25:32,570 --> 00:25:30,320 skeptics and doubts sir Canberra 556 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:32,580 skeptics take issue with the statements 557 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:35,610 of mr. rod Roach organizer of the 558 00:25:40,130 --> 00:25:38,010 alternative medicine and ESP festival 559 00:25:41,450 --> 00:25:40,140 last weekend the skeptics offer of 560 00:25:43,490 --> 00:25:41,460 twenty thousand dollars for a 561 00:25:46,910 --> 00:25:43,500 demonstration of paranormal phenomena is 562 00:25:49,700 --> 00:25:46,920 not quite so controlled that they can't 563 00:25:52,190 --> 00:25:49,710 get a result anyway end quote the 564 00:25:54,950 --> 00:25:52,200 controls are normal scientific controls 565 00:25:57,110 --> 00:25:54,960 designed to eliminate results arising 566 00:25:59,600 --> 00:25:57,120 from chance fraud or self deception on 567 00:26:01,610 --> 00:25:59,610 the part of the investigator or the 568 00:26:03,770 --> 00:26:01,620 subject these skeptics had little to say 569 00:26:06,500 --> 00:26:03,780 about alternative medicine based on the 570 00:26:08,870 --> 00:26:06,510 use of herbs and acupuncture except to 571 00:26:12,410 --> 00:26:08,880 advise the public to exercise discretion 572 00:26:14,270 --> 00:26:12,420 in evaluating claims the main problem 573 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:14,280 with alternative medicine is that there 574 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:16,890 are so many alternatives the skeptics 575 00:26:21,050 --> 00:26:19,050 question more severely the presence of 576 00:26:24,260 --> 00:26:21,060 psychics and clairvoyants at the 577 00:26:26,360 --> 00:26:24,270 festival engaging in character reading 578 00:26:28,490 --> 00:26:26,370 and predictions on the basis of methods 579 00:26:31,430 --> 00:26:28,500 such as astrology tarot reading and 580 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:31,440 numerology methods for which there is no 581 00:26:37,120 --> 00:26:34,170 acceptable scientific basis and which 582 00:26:39,650 --> 00:26:37,130 have never yet been able to demonstrate 583 00:26:43,670 --> 00:26:39,660 results better than chance under 584 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:43,680 controlled conditions mr. Roche also 585 00:26:48,500 --> 00:26:45,930 said that if he had known the skeptics 586 00:26:50,990 --> 00:26:48,510 were to be there he would have organized 587 00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:51,000 a demonstration of fire walking quote 588 00:26:56,900 --> 00:26:54,450 and you can't fake that unquote however 589 00:26:59,240 --> 00:26:56,910 research by skeptics indicates that fire 590 00:27:01,820 --> 00:26:59,250 walking does not involve any paranormal 591 00:27:03,590 --> 00:27:01,830 phenomena and can be done by anyone it 592 00:27:06,500 --> 00:27:03,600 is also interesting that mr. Roche 593 00:27:09,490 --> 00:27:06,510 claimed not to know what a quote 594 00:27:11,630 --> 00:27:09,500 charlatans end quote is every other 595 00:27:13,490 --> 00:27:11,640 organization dealing with the public is 596 00:27:16,220 --> 00:27:13,500 keen to expose it's unethical 597 00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:16,230 practitioners to enhance the reputation 598 00:27:22,550 --> 00:27:18,890 of the quote professionals men quote on 599 00:27:25,220 --> 00:27:22,560 mr. roaches claim that the skeptics got 600 00:27:26,930 --> 00:27:25,230 free publicity from this festival the 601 00:27:29,540 --> 00:27:26,940 boot may well be on the other foot 602 00:27:32,270 --> 00:27:29,550 certainly psychics mystics and healers 603 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:32,280 were notoriously reluctant to gain any 604 00:27:36,620 --> 00:27:34,410 publicity from the well attended 605 00:27:38,670 --> 00:27:36,630 skeptics conference in Melbourne last 606 00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:38,680 Easter also mr. 607 00:27:43,620 --> 00:27:40,570 which avoided any possibility of public 608 00:27:46,290 --> 00:27:43,630 debate with skeptics in Canberra mr. 609 00:27:49,170 --> 00:27:46,300 Roach also said that his quote people & 610 00:27:52,730 --> 00:27:49,180 quot paid quote a heck of a lot of money 611 00:27:55,470 --> 00:27:52,740 and quote to participate in his festival 612 00:27:58,040 --> 00:27:55,480 skeptics ask only whether they did this 613 00:28:00,810 --> 00:27:58,050 to gain public benefit or whether as 614 00:28:02,970 --> 00:28:00,820 quote professionals and quote they 615 00:28:07,410 --> 00:28:02,980 expected to recap a handsome profit from 616 00:28:19,130 --> 00:28:07,420 a gullible public Don laycock Canberra 617 00:28:24,450 --> 00:28:21,810 finally we have a reply to the letter to 618 00:28:29,070 --> 00:28:24,460 the editor from the skeptics and this is 619 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:29,080 dated wednesday june the fourth 1986 620 00:28:43,420 --> 00:28:39,610 doubting the skeptics view received may 621 00:28:44,950 --> 00:28:43,430 29 sir regarding the letter from the 622 00:28:48,550 --> 00:28:44,960 Canberra committee of Australian 623 00:28:50,860 --> 00:28:48,560 skeptics canberra times may 27th was 624 00:28:53,350 --> 00:28:50,870 like stepping into a time capsule and 625 00:28:56,230 --> 00:28:53,360 watching the inquisition question 626 00:28:58,930 --> 00:28:56,240 galilea I got the distinct impression 627 00:29:02,110 --> 00:28:58,940 that the skeptics are sorry that we do 628 00:29:05,170 --> 00:29:02,120 not burn at the stake anymore I don't 629 00:29:08,650 --> 00:29:05,180 know what paranormally is not so long 630 00:29:11,950 --> 00:29:08,660 ago hypnotism telepathy telekinesis at 631 00:29:14,830 --> 00:29:11,960 our worst spooky now they are recognized 632 00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:14,840 by Orthodox science good heavens what's 633 00:29:20,170 --> 00:29:17,450 the world coming to we have departments 634 00:29:22,930 --> 00:29:20,180 of parapsychology in our institutions of 635 00:29:25,900 --> 00:29:22,940 learning the skeptics talk of science 636 00:29:28,180 --> 00:29:25,910 and scientific methods but what if some 637 00:29:30,790 --> 00:29:28,190 phenomena don't follow skeptics rules 638 00:29:33,700 --> 00:29:30,800 doesn't mean the phenomena don't exist 639 00:29:36,820 --> 00:29:33,710 the investigation of mediums is a case 640 00:29:41,290 --> 00:29:36,830 in point mediums are human some are good 641 00:29:43,980 --> 00:29:41,300 some are bad some cheat so what is the 642 00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:43,990 whole field therefore discredited is 643 00:29:48,460 --> 00:29:46,370 Beethoven a charlatan because he 644 00:29:51,130 --> 00:29:48,470 couldn't produce a masterpiece all the 645 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:51,140 time a whole range of phenomena now has 646 00:29:56,350 --> 00:29:53,170 a huge Bank of evidence supporting it 647 00:29:58,930 --> 00:29:56,360 various mental physical and psychic 648 00:30:01,260 --> 00:29:58,940 phenomena it's a pity it doesn't fall 649 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:01,270 within the skeptics black or white 650 00:30:08,070 --> 00:30:04,970 tabulation but it exists nonetheless and 651 00:30:10,050 --> 00:30:08,080 one would have to be ridiculously 652 00:30:12,940 --> 00:30:10,060 narrow-minded to pretend otherwise 653 00:30:15,010 --> 00:30:12,950 neither will these manifestations go 654 00:30:18,100 --> 00:30:15,020 away just because the Canberra committee 655 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:18,110 of Australian skeptics says so as for 656 00:30:24,130 --> 00:30:22,250 the $20,000 quotes reward end quote now 657 00:30:27,670 --> 00:30:24,140 when do the skeptics are troubled by 658 00:30:30,220 --> 00:30:27,680 charlatans they have issued an RSVP to 659 00:30:32,380 --> 00:30:30,230 every charlatan within miles knowledge 660 00:30:35,230 --> 00:30:32,390 cannot be bought the skeptics would do 661 00:30:37,810 --> 00:30:35,240 much better to adopt a truly scientific 662 00:30:39,970 --> 00:30:37,820 attitude and go out among the healers 663 00:30:42,580 --> 00:30:39,980 psychics and mediums and quietly 664 00:30:45,670 --> 00:30:42,590 investigate be open-minded but not 665 00:30:49,210 --> 00:30:45,680 gullible admit that their well-defined 666 00:30:50,259 --> 00:30:49,220 universe may be boundless as for 667 00:30:53,109 --> 00:30:50,269 firewalking 668 00:30:55,419 --> 00:30:53,119 and I don't know if it is paranormal it 669 00:30:57,759 --> 00:30:55,429 would be fun to see the skeptics all in 670 00:31:00,310 --> 00:30:57,769 a row hotfooting it across a fire pit 671 00:31:02,199 --> 00:31:00,320 made by the psychics perhaps the 672 00:31:11,079 --> 00:31:02,209 astrologers could predict what would 673 00:31:12,669 --> 00:31:11,089 happen Larry snitsky chifley now I'd 674 00:31:15,909 --> 00:31:12,679 like to draw your attention to something 675 00:31:20,259 --> 00:31:15,919 that was mentioned in that last letter 676 00:31:22,239 --> 00:31:20,269 where Larry stitz Key says the 677 00:31:24,969 --> 00:31:22,249 investigation of mediums is a case in 678 00:31:28,419 --> 00:31:24,979 point mediums are human some are good 679 00:31:30,989 --> 00:31:28,429 some are bad some cheat so what is the 680 00:31:33,699 --> 00:31:30,999 whole field therefore discredited is 681 00:31:35,979 --> 00:31:33,709 Beethoven a charlatan because he 682 00:31:39,430 --> 00:31:35,989 couldn't produce masterpieces all the 683 00:31:42,159 --> 00:31:39,440 time ? it's a wonderful sort of straw 684 00:31:44,919 --> 00:31:42,169 man argument and we get this a lot 685 00:31:46,869 --> 00:31:44,929 skeptics get this a lot if we point out 686 00:31:48,459 --> 00:31:46,879 things like predictions for example 687 00:31:50,979 --> 00:31:48,469 which will be covering very soon on the 688 00:31:53,709 --> 00:31:50,989 skeptic zone the psychic predictions for 689 00:31:55,690 --> 00:31:53,719 this year and if we point out the fact 690 00:31:58,239 --> 00:31:55,700 that this prediction was wrong or this 691 00:31:59,649 --> 00:31:58,249 was wrong or they something tremendous 692 00:32:02,919 --> 00:31:59,659 happened which wasn't predicted and so 693 00:32:05,349 --> 00:32:02,929 on the the complaint will often get back 694 00:32:06,879 --> 00:32:05,359 is I well we're not perfect nobody said 695 00:32:11,229 --> 00:32:06,889 we can do it 100 percent of the time as 696 00:32:13,180 --> 00:32:11,239 if skeptics ever said to the psychics 697 00:32:16,149 --> 00:32:13,190 you must be correct one hundred percent 698 00:32:17,739 --> 00:32:16,159 of the time it's a red herring it's 699 00:32:21,639 --> 00:32:17,749 ridiculous of course we never said that 700 00:32:26,979 --> 00:32:21,649 but I like what he says here mediums are 701 00:32:29,049 --> 00:32:26,989 human well yes but they pretend to be so 702 00:32:31,509 --> 00:32:29,059 much more they have the abilities far 703 00:32:34,869 --> 00:32:31,519 beyond the normal human and there's a 704 00:32:36,759 --> 00:32:34,879 whole other rabbit hole in itself what 705 00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:36,769 skeptics would like to have of course is 706 00:32:41,019 --> 00:32:38,450 simply good evidence for the paranormal 707 00:32:42,909 --> 00:32:41,029 or the claims made by these people it 708 00:32:44,709 --> 00:32:42,919 doesn't have to be one hundred percent I 709 00:32:47,019 --> 00:32:44,719 think we've never asked for one hundred 710 00:32:49,419 --> 00:32:47,029 percent it just has to be of course 711 00:32:52,060 --> 00:32:49,429 above well above what chance would put 712 00:32:57,249 --> 00:32:52,070 predict but there you go an interesting 713 00:33:01,080 --> 00:32:57,259 chain of reports from the skeptics way 714 00:33:04,350 --> 00:33:01,090 back in nineteen eighty six 715 00:33:06,150 --> 00:33:04,360 and it's amazing what you bump into so 716 00:33:09,210 --> 00:33:06,160 to speak on the internet when you're 717 00:33:11,550 --> 00:33:09,220 doing a little bit of research a link to 718 00:33:29,620 --> 00:33:11,560 the search engine I used in this week's 719 00:33:36,860 --> 00:33:33,500 and now direct from the cafe at 720 00:33:44,030 --> 00:33:36,870 Australia's science channel its brouhaha 721 00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:44,040 with Tanya Meyer is the Bermuda Triangle 722 00:33:49,660 --> 00:33:47,130 still an unsolved paranormal mystery or 723 00:33:51,620 --> 00:33:49,670 of scientists just figured it out 724 00:33:54,070 --> 00:33:51,630 stories about ships and planes 725 00:33:57,290 --> 00:33:54,080 disappearing in the area between Bermuda 726 00:34:01,160 --> 00:33:57,300 Florida and Puerto Rico date back to 727 00:34:03,380 --> 00:34:01,170 Christopher Columbus in 1492 what's 728 00:34:05,420 --> 00:34:03,390 making headlines now is that new 729 00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:05,430 satellite images have got a couple of 730 00:34:11,330 --> 00:34:08,130 scientists excited about hexagonal 731 00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:11,340 shaped clouds they say that these clouds 732 00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:15,690 cause microbursts or air bombs air comes 733 00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:17,490 down out of the cloud at around a 734 00:34:23,270 --> 00:34:19,890 hundred and seventy miles per hour and 735 00:34:26,270 --> 00:34:23,280 hits the ocean making waves up to 45 736 00:34:29,300 --> 00:34:26,280 feet high now there's a couple of 737 00:34:30,830 --> 00:34:29,310 problems with this one is that no other 738 00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:30,840 scientists have got on board with this 739 00:34:36,710 --> 00:34:34,170 theory to these clouds form in other 740 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:36,720 places around the world without causing 741 00:34:42,350 --> 00:34:40,170 carnage and three the biggest problem is 742 00:34:47,609 --> 00:34:42,360 that the Bermuda Triangle doesn't even 743 00:35:02,009 --> 00:34:50,579 for more brouhaha and Australian science 744 00:35:04,980 --> 00:35:02,019 head for ww Australia science TV join us 745 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:04,990 now for drinking skeptically in the 746 00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:15,130 think tank here we are folks at a well 747 00:35:19,319 --> 00:35:17,170 known place with a few well-known voices 748 00:35:23,069 --> 00:35:19,329 but i'll let it over to the man who's on 749 00:35:25,859 --> 00:35:23,079 the scene it's a skeptic himself mr. 750 00:35:27,299 --> 00:35:25,869 skeptic mr. hello Maynard yes we're back 751 00:35:28,890 --> 00:35:27,309 at the club down the end of the street 752 00:35:30,989 --> 00:35:28,900 we're having a mini think tank haven't 753 00:35:32,759 --> 00:35:30,999 had one here for a long time we're in 754 00:35:34,049 --> 00:35:32,769 the same restaurant where we always had 755 00:35:36,630 --> 00:35:34,059 the think tanks and we've got a special 756 00:35:38,940 --> 00:35:36,640 guest Steve Roberts go from Melbourne 757 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:38,950 yeah g'day mate yeah and you always meet 758 00:35:42,930 --> 00:35:40,690 here yours wheat here for think tank 759 00:35:45,539 --> 00:35:42,940 yeah very civilized the nice up there 760 00:35:48,589 --> 00:35:45,549 and ambience and all all the all the 761 00:35:50,609 --> 00:35:48,599 stuff and your engineering specialty is 762 00:35:53,279 --> 00:35:50,619 cryptography yeah the making and 763 00:35:55,499 --> 00:35:53,289 breaking of secret codes yes and what's 764 00:35:57,569 --> 00:35:55,509 the word for when they hide a code 765 00:35:59,579 --> 00:35:57,579 inside a JPG thing what's that cool 766 00:36:01,229 --> 00:35:59,589 that's called steganography well you may 767 00:36:03,479 --> 00:36:01,239 still get into it today it's where you 768 00:36:05,130 --> 00:36:03,489 hide that a message evil exists they 769 00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:05,140 used to shave the head of a slave and 770 00:36:08,039 --> 00:36:06,249 write the message on it wait for the 771 00:36:11,099 --> 00:36:08,049 hair to grow and send the poor bug 772 00:36:13,410 --> 00:36:11,109 around 3,000 years ago yeah you can hide 773 00:36:15,749 --> 00:36:13,420 mr. stuff in a JPEG in the low level of 774 00:36:18,210 --> 00:36:15,759 the JP could hide a message it's easy to 775 00:36:19,890 --> 00:36:18,220 take because you can just clean the JPEG 776 00:36:21,779 --> 00:36:19,900 up you think why these bits at the low 777 00:36:23,249 --> 00:36:21,789 level the JPEG that just make it noisy 778 00:36:25,799 --> 00:36:23,259 yeah and you can take them out and 779 00:36:28,799 --> 00:36:25,809 there's a message so that's the word for 780 00:36:30,329 --> 00:36:28,809 the day steganography I mean you had a 781 00:36:32,849 --> 00:36:30,339 question for Steve a little bit earlier 782 00:36:34,890 --> 00:36:32,859 on about that the Bermuda Triangle and 783 00:36:36,660 --> 00:36:34,900 warp bubbles which I thought was quite 784 00:36:39,359 --> 00:36:36,670 interesting as you know I love listening 785 00:36:42,059 --> 00:36:39,369 to all sorts of podcasts more round the 786 00:36:45,539 --> 00:36:42,069 place and on the recent UFO podcast this 787 00:36:47,579 --> 00:36:45,549 week there was a david perez i think his 788 00:36:50,700 --> 00:36:47,589 name was and he was talking about a warp 789 00:36:52,289 --> 00:36:50,710 drive that he's been working on but he 790 00:36:56,279 --> 00:36:52,299 also said that it's possible the warp 791 00:36:58,440 --> 00:36:56,289 bubbles occur naturally with in certain 792 00:37:00,210 --> 00:36:58,450 lightning storms because they can this 793 00:37:00,770 --> 00:37:00,220 and usually it destroys the objects that 794 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:00,780 that's in 795 00:37:03,950 --> 00:37:02,130 but sometimes you get a plane that will 796 00:37:05,330 --> 00:37:03,960 arrive early somewhere and it can be 797 00:37:06,950 --> 00:37:05,340 proved that it seems to have got there 798 00:37:10,070 --> 00:37:06,960 quicker because didn't some sort of warp 799 00:37:13,340 --> 00:37:10,080 bubble miguel alcubierre 1994 came up 800 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:13,350 with this idea theory about the fabric 801 00:37:17,450 --> 00:37:15,090 of space being able to compress it and 802 00:37:20,390 --> 00:37:17,460 creating a local space warp bubble were 803 00:37:22,970 --> 00:37:20,400 within the side the bubble if it was a 804 00:37:25,340 --> 00:37:22,980 spacecraft or an aircraft which we have 805 00:37:27,890 --> 00:37:25,350 anecdotal evidence up that the crew 806 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:27,900 would be protected from the momentum the 807 00:37:33,140 --> 00:37:29,850 point being is that a lot of people have 808 00:37:35,990 --> 00:37:33,150 observed a craft a UFO that they have 809 00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:36,000 cited making 90-degree turns right with 810 00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:37,530 an aircraft you're not going to do that 811 00:37:41,810 --> 00:37:39,210 you're going to be spam in a can if 812 00:37:43,670 --> 00:37:41,820 you're going you know like och3 or so so 813 00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:43,680 there are limitations physically that 814 00:37:49,430 --> 00:37:46,890 you have in the air with aerial vehicles 815 00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:49,440 that humans produce on these particular 816 00:37:54,530 --> 00:37:52,410 craft the momentum the crew is protected 817 00:37:56,630 --> 00:37:54,540 so you could turn on a dime the warp 818 00:37:59,270 --> 00:37:56,640 bubble literally protects you do you 819 00:38:01,100 --> 00:37:59,280 think there's anything to this so it's 820 00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:01,110 the whole plane that arrives early it 821 00:38:05,150 --> 00:38:03,930 doesn't have one wing missing it I think 822 00:38:06,890 --> 00:38:05,160 the other ones all crashed and I think 823 00:38:09,050 --> 00:38:06,900 if there's a there's an example of four 824 00:38:10,340 --> 00:38:09,060 or five planes anecdotally and the 825 00:38:12,170 --> 00:38:10,350 entire history of the world that can be 826 00:38:14,300 --> 00:38:12,180 proved they arrived early by reason to 827 00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:14,310 can't be explained you'd wonder if it 828 00:38:19,010 --> 00:38:16,650 maybe half the plane including behalf of 829 00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:19,020 oddi of the passengers is in the warm 830 00:38:23,390 --> 00:38:20,490 bubbly other half is not that will be 831 00:38:25,250 --> 00:38:23,400 bother tragic we needed the vomit bag 832 00:38:27,560 --> 00:38:25,260 when you leave a saying that there's a 833 00:38:28,910 --> 00:38:27,570 lot of power in a lightning storm and it 834 00:38:32,140 --> 00:38:28,920 might be able to do this kind of thing 835 00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:32,150 in a random kind of way around about the 836 00:38:36,230 --> 00:38:34,530 Caribbean area there well what do you 837 00:38:37,970 --> 00:38:36,240 think what is it is there any way you 838 00:38:40,130 --> 00:38:37,980 could even test that because I mean how 839 00:38:41,810 --> 00:38:40,140 could you mimic the energy in a 840 00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:41,820 lightning storm and put that into some 841 00:38:45,620 --> 00:38:43,770 way of creating a warp bubble it sounds 842 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:45,630 a little bit advanced for me Oh Benjamin 843 00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:47,490 Franklin went down I like install with a 844 00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:49,890 silk rope of the key and nearly got into 845 00:38:53,330 --> 00:38:51,690 serious trouble but you know there is a 846 00:38:56,180 --> 00:38:53,340 lot of power and a light install but to 847 00:38:59,090 --> 00:38:56,190 to walk reality like that you need a lot 848 00:39:01,250 --> 00:38:59,100 lot lot lot more power than that right 849 00:39:02,510 --> 00:39:01,260 the lightning storm just wouldn't do you 850 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:02,520 need to be able to sort of been to 851 00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:03,850 planet or something 852 00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:07,010 if you get a distort reality you know it 853 00:39:11,650 --> 00:39:09,770 hasn't been done yet but you need a well 854 00:39:14,020 --> 00:39:11,660 treatment even think of it you need a 855 00:39:17,290 --> 00:39:14,030 huge amount of power and what will that 856 00:39:19,270 --> 00:39:17,300 this david prep is also a positing that 857 00:39:21,430 --> 00:39:19,280 perhaps one of the reasons why UFOs seem 858 00:39:23,110 --> 00:39:21,440 to be able to turn and do things without 859 00:39:24,220 --> 00:39:23,120 damaging who might be inside it's 860 00:39:26,170 --> 00:39:24,230 because there might be some sort of 861 00:39:27,220 --> 00:39:26,180 minor some sort of minor warp bubble 862 00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:27,230 going on there so they're not actually 863 00:39:31,450 --> 00:39:29,450 being affected by the g-force changes 864 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:31,460 that will be without the lightning storm 865 00:39:35,350 --> 00:39:33,170 in the 30 years maybe they have some 866 00:39:38,110 --> 00:39:35,360 secret of propulsion and maybe they can 867 00:39:39,340 --> 00:39:38,120 maybe they can not obey the laws of 868 00:39:41,530 --> 00:39:39,350 physics because I mean the laws of 869 00:39:44,130 --> 00:39:41,540 physics are quite give us taking this 870 00:39:46,330 --> 00:39:44,140 sort of situation but if they have some 871 00:39:47,830 --> 00:39:46,340 secret energy stores you have to sort of 872 00:39:49,870 --> 00:39:47,840 warp reality and go into the fourth 873 00:39:52,290 --> 00:39:49,880 dimension don't the laws of physics 874 00:39:58,720 --> 00:39:52,300 allow for some sort of warping of space 875 00:40:01,260 --> 00:39:58,730 no so I've just been reading the wrong 876 00:40:04,240 --> 00:40:01,270 napkin in the back there obviously here 877 00:40:05,650 --> 00:40:04,250 steve has been on the committee of 878 00:40:08,470 --> 00:40:05,660 Australian skeptics for many many many 879 00:40:11,020 --> 00:40:08,480 many men 30 plus years of course and he 880 00:40:12,340 --> 00:40:11,030 is one of our UFO experts and Steve we 881 00:40:14,530 --> 00:40:12,350 were just discussing a little while ago 882 00:40:17,050 --> 00:40:14,540 this case in the outback from nineteen 883 00:40:18,550 --> 00:40:17,060 eighty-eight with the Knowles family I 884 00:40:20,140 --> 00:40:18,560 think this is where there was some sort 885 00:40:21,850 --> 00:40:20,150 of residue on top of their car is that 886 00:40:23,620 --> 00:40:21,860 the one yeah well you drive a car across 887 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:23,630 the Nullarbor plain low busy do all over 888 00:40:27,730 --> 00:40:25,970 it's all I can say and if you if you 889 00:40:30,610 --> 00:40:27,740 fall asleep and tip it off the bone it 890 00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:30,620 rolls over there's more residue on it if 891 00:40:33,670 --> 00:40:31,970 you haven't service the brakes or wash 892 00:40:36,220 --> 00:40:33,680 the car late there's more wizardy on it 893 00:40:37,570 --> 00:40:36,230 still and in the end you can make a 894 00:40:39,850 --> 00:40:37,580 story out of it was there anything 895 00:40:43,180 --> 00:40:39,860 unusual about the residue button no it 896 00:40:45,580 --> 00:40:43,190 was the material from fake pads so sorry 897 00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:45,590 if you don't know that the listeners 898 00:40:50,260 --> 00:40:48,170 made it a fairly famous one it's one of 899 00:40:52,570 --> 00:40:50,270 the ones that has held up by many people 900 00:40:55,270 --> 00:40:52,580 are into the paranormal as being because 901 00:40:57,010 --> 00:40:55,280 of the amount of witnesses involved well 902 00:40:59,110 --> 00:40:57,020 not really well yeah there wasn't that 903 00:41:00,700 --> 00:40:59,120 many what happened was visitor who don't 904 00:41:02,830 --> 00:41:00,710 know there was a family of four 905 00:41:05,260 --> 00:41:02,840 traveling across the Australian desert 906 00:41:09,829 --> 00:41:05,270 it was near dawn in a very remote area 907 00:41:12,910 --> 00:41:09,839 of western australia in 1988 january 908 00:41:15,229 --> 00:41:12,920 they claimed they were chased by lights 909 00:41:17,690 --> 00:41:15,239 something landed on top of their car 910 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:17,700 there's mixed reports whether the cows 911 00:41:24,829 --> 00:41:20,130 lifted off the road or not and a tire 912 00:41:26,559 --> 00:41:24,839 was blown but on upon inspection the car 913 00:41:29,269 --> 00:41:26,569 and the tire was all consistent with a 914 00:41:31,579 --> 00:41:29,279 tire being blown all right and that's it 915 00:41:33,739 --> 00:41:31,589 and who undertook the inspections day 916 00:41:36,140 --> 00:41:33,749 well they um they drove across the 917 00:41:37,910 --> 00:41:36,150 Nullarbor driving all night you're 918 00:41:40,700 --> 00:41:37,920 clearly all for that included the driver 919 00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:40,710 or asleep and the tire bursts the car 920 00:41:44,089 --> 00:41:42,930 went off the road rolled over well I 921 00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:44,099 don't think it did I do that you're all 922 00:41:47,630 --> 00:41:45,210 that there was no evidence that it 923 00:41:49,430 --> 00:41:47,640 rolled over it just came to a stop the 924 00:41:52,130 --> 00:41:49,440 people who undertook the analysis was 925 00:41:53,299 --> 00:41:52,140 the I've written it down it's there's 926 00:41:56,959 --> 00:41:53,309 something something government or 927 00:41:58,849 --> 00:41:56,969 something lab or was forensic lab I it 928 00:42:00,469 --> 00:41:58,859 just wasn't split the stuff on the car 929 00:42:02,749 --> 00:42:00,479 wasn't special it was from the debt the 930 00:42:04,609 --> 00:42:02,759 break mmm yeah it makes a great story 931 00:42:06,319 --> 00:42:04,619 though they they they thought they'd 932 00:42:07,969 --> 00:42:06,329 been abducted there on steve vai's arts 933 00:42:10,849 --> 00:42:07,979 program when I was in the audience and 934 00:42:13,459 --> 00:42:10,859 my eyelid shredded them so much there's 935 00:42:15,380 --> 00:42:13,469 no need for a skeptic for them he asked 936 00:42:18,049 --> 00:42:15,390 what they do with the car they said i 937 00:42:20,269 --> 00:42:18,059 will we sold it and he said yeah I 938 00:42:22,849 --> 00:42:20,279 realized this he pull it an advert he 939 00:42:24,979 --> 00:42:22,859 done in on a bit bored you know talana 940 00:42:26,630 --> 00:42:24,989 for say a little bit wise you know with 941 00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:26,640 your honor but they're an awesome car 942 00:42:32,059 --> 00:42:29,130 was at an LJ or an XX you one there 943 00:42:33,859 --> 00:42:32,069 wasn't a toll on ya what was it so they 944 00:42:36,019 --> 00:42:33,869 were on the Steve visor because I've got 945 00:42:38,539 --> 00:42:36,029 clips of them from all lots of chat 946 00:42:39,890 --> 00:42:38,549 shows at the time but I have got nothing 947 00:42:42,109 --> 00:42:39,900 from the Steve by sideshow that's 948 00:42:43,670 --> 00:42:42,119 interesting you miss so much there soon 949 00:42:45,950 --> 00:42:43,680 as I was in the audience for God's sake 950 00:42:47,569 --> 00:42:45,960 lees and heavy loss and we even spoke on 951 00:42:50,410 --> 00:42:47,579 that on the air but yeah yeah there's a 952 00:42:54,079 --> 00:42:50,420 car for sale 20 million miles only 953 00:42:56,719 --> 00:42:54,089 slightly poor condition yeah okay well 954 00:43:00,380 --> 00:42:56,729 look oh ok mr. funny skeptic people what 955 00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:00,390 about one of the most mass UFO sightings 956 00:43:05,269 --> 00:43:01,890 in Australia's history which was in 957 00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:05,279 Melbourne in weston in 1966 the school's 958 00:43:10,279 --> 00:43:07,170 citing what what do you make of that to 959 00:43:12,319 --> 00:43:10,289 where you do ever look into that one not 960 00:43:14,299 --> 00:43:12,329 directly I wasn't there a time but it 961 00:43:15,709 --> 00:43:14,309 was a hood from school boys I think I 962 00:43:18,599 --> 00:43:15,719 think what happened there wasn't some 963 00:43:21,359 --> 00:43:18,609 kid in the school saw something special 964 00:43:23,309 --> 00:43:21,369 all once a youth illogically special but 965 00:43:25,589 --> 00:43:23,319 you're the fire engine going by or 966 00:43:28,019 --> 00:43:25,599 something and the story sort of got out 967 00:43:30,870 --> 00:43:28,029 of hand and was going around in rumors 968 00:43:32,609 --> 00:43:30,880 and the following morning journalists 969 00:43:35,579 --> 00:43:32,619 turned up and began grilling the kids on 970 00:43:37,170 --> 00:43:35,589 the way into school and you know just 971 00:43:39,660 --> 00:43:37,180 being a general nuisance and they had 972 00:43:42,359 --> 00:43:39,670 laughter then said that a same day you 973 00:43:44,279 --> 00:43:42,369 know nobody talked about this story it's 974 00:43:46,109 --> 00:43:44,289 forbidden I say so on the head and after 975 00:43:47,970 --> 00:43:46,119 that we do detentions handed out all 976 00:43:50,039 --> 00:43:47,980 around you know so after that kids who 977 00:43:52,910 --> 00:43:50,049 say you will that we saw something but 978 00:43:55,170 --> 00:43:52,920 we were told not to talk about it 979 00:43:57,029 --> 00:43:55,180 another another analysis it was 980 00:44:00,059 --> 00:43:57,039 supposedly the intervention of people in 981 00:44:02,039 --> 00:44:00,069 military uniform yet again I think what 982 00:44:03,900 --> 00:44:02,049 I would probably do is direct people to 983 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:03,910 Brian Dunning skip droid episode on the 984 00:44:07,499 --> 00:44:05,650 West all we covered this and yeah I'd 985 00:44:09,269 --> 00:44:07,509 also recommend they have a look at the 986 00:44:13,440 --> 00:44:09,279 documentary on the same one to the 987 00:44:14,519 --> 00:44:13,450 people that were involved and I find 988 00:44:16,589 --> 00:44:14,529 that it was because there are a lot of 989 00:44:18,809 --> 00:44:16,599 people who claim they saw something that 990 00:44:20,849 --> 00:44:18,819 day I don't know if anybody really saw 991 00:44:23,279 --> 00:44:20,859 something but I think the rumor goes 992 00:44:24,630 --> 00:44:23,289 around the only school boys and maybe 993 00:44:26,700 --> 00:44:24,640 there was a policeman or something 994 00:44:28,529 --> 00:44:26,710 investigating that uniform characters 995 00:44:31,170 --> 00:44:28,539 and some excitement song official 996 00:44:32,940 --> 00:44:31,180 noticed you know the headmaster says not 997 00:44:35,370 --> 00:44:32,950 now don't talk about this and now it all 998 00:44:37,940 --> 00:44:35,380 becomes secret and thereby becomes a 999 00:44:40,890 --> 00:44:37,950 conspiracy of silence with the 1000 00:44:43,859 --> 00:44:40,900 interference of the authorities and you 1001 00:44:47,519 --> 00:44:43,869 can just cash in on all that since I'm 1002 00:44:48,930 --> 00:44:47,529 oh I don't have to kill you so edgy look 1003 00:44:51,180 --> 00:44:48,940 what do you think rich because you know 1004 00:44:52,589 --> 00:44:51,190 I'm always big on on the fact that when 1005 00:44:53,759 --> 00:44:52,599 people see these things they can't 1006 00:44:56,009 --> 00:44:53,769 always get a good photo because they 1007 00:44:57,239 --> 00:44:56,019 happen quickly often there at night and 1008 00:44:59,069 --> 00:44:57,249 you can't get a good photo even with the 1009 00:45:00,839 --> 00:44:59,079 camera phone these days of some bright 1010 00:45:02,759 --> 00:45:00,849 object on dark background like that and 1011 00:45:04,650 --> 00:45:02,769 yet people are repeatedly seeing 1012 00:45:07,499 --> 00:45:04,660 something going on here you know you 1013 00:45:08,819 --> 00:45:07,509 know I've got one foot in that camp one 1014 00:45:11,819 --> 00:45:08,829 foot in the grave that's the expression 1015 00:45:14,729 --> 00:45:11,829 yeah his is something that swayed me 1016 00:45:17,339 --> 00:45:14,739 many years ago I saw talk by Bob 1017 00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:17,349 Sheppard think it was famous UFO 1018 00:45:21,690 --> 00:45:19,450 together he was in Australia and he 1019 00:45:23,219 --> 00:45:21,700 showed a picture of an astro Comet and 1020 00:45:25,170 --> 00:45:23,229 asteroid something that entered the 1021 00:45:26,819 --> 00:45:25,180 Earth's atmosphere which was only 1022 00:45:28,769 --> 00:45:26,829 visible for very short time as it 1023 00:45:31,019 --> 00:45:28,779 streaked across the United States very 1024 00:45:33,960 --> 00:45:31,029 short time and yet there are all these 1025 00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:33,970 photographs of it it was a very rare 1026 00:45:38,819 --> 00:45:35,890 event people had seconds they get their 1027 00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:38,829 camera and they did they did and he said 1028 00:45:42,870 --> 00:45:40,690 well what about if there are UFOs 1029 00:45:45,569 --> 00:45:42,880 everywhere you know buzzing the planet 1030 00:45:47,249 --> 00:45:45,579 and abducting people this got to be more 1031 00:45:49,380 --> 00:45:47,259 photographs more good quality 1032 00:45:50,700 --> 00:45:49,390 photographs you know and we've mentioned 1033 00:45:51,870 --> 00:45:50,710 this on the skipper exam before now 1034 00:45:53,539 --> 00:45:51,880 we're all walking around with 1035 00:45:56,670 --> 00:45:53,549 high-definition video cameras and 1036 00:45:59,880 --> 00:45:56,680 ridiculous say things like this there 1037 00:46:01,289 --> 00:45:59,890 should be a an avalanche of spaceship 1038 00:46:03,509 --> 00:46:01,299 photographs and there's not there's 1039 00:46:05,430 --> 00:46:03,519 known as it been a recent UFO flap in 1040 00:46:07,799 --> 00:46:05,440 Australia at all know that has that the 1041 00:46:09,839 --> 00:46:07,809 last one was Kelly Carla 1993 that was a 1042 00:46:11,339 --> 00:46:09,849 hallucination and because Richard said 1043 00:46:13,380 --> 00:46:11,349 there's evidence a camera now and it was 1044 00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:13,390 actually an even advert for mobile 1045 00:46:18,059 --> 00:46:15,130 phones on their first invented the 1046 00:46:20,940 --> 00:46:18,069 Telstra put advert out somebody in a 1047 00:46:22,739 --> 00:46:20,950 field is Flying Saucer lands and they 1048 00:46:24,749 --> 00:46:22,749 pulled out his mobile phone which nobody 1049 00:46:28,440 --> 00:46:24,759 had at the time they said they said 1050 00:46:30,420 --> 00:46:28,450 quick call somebody in the early days in 1051 00:46:32,339 --> 00:46:30,430 the 1950s of George Adamski and those 1052 00:46:35,099 --> 00:46:32,349 UFOs them people didn't even have 1053 00:46:37,709 --> 00:46:35,109 cameras my father had one that was the 1054 00:46:39,450 --> 00:46:37,719 family's camera we got through one film 1055 00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:39,460 a year or something and it was exotic to 1056 00:46:43,769 --> 00:46:41,410 be there with a camera for the common 1057 00:46:45,660 --> 00:46:43,779 man and now of course there's cameras 1058 00:46:47,549 --> 00:46:45,670 everywhere heaven everybody has run in 1059 00:46:50,039 --> 00:46:47,559 their phone and we have school to school 1060 00:46:51,450 --> 00:46:50,049 kids all have a camera and there should 1061 00:46:52,859 --> 00:46:51,460 be a lot more UFO pictures there's 1062 00:46:55,049 --> 00:46:52,869 actually a lot fewer your phone pictures 1063 00:46:56,160 --> 00:46:55,059 so that a well let's go to the UK where 1064 00:46:58,349 --> 00:46:56,170 you're a bit more what about the 1065 00:47:00,719 --> 00:46:58,359 rendlesham forest incident from I think 1066 00:47:02,729 --> 00:47:00,729 1980 it was where where you have a 1067 00:47:04,799 --> 00:47:02,739 military guy claiming actually touched 1068 00:47:06,779 --> 00:47:04,809 an object that landed the touchdown I 1069 00:47:08,670 --> 00:47:06,789 don't do the actual touching be it was 1070 00:47:11,999 --> 00:47:08,680 in a policy Norfolk where there's a 1071 00:47:14,789 --> 00:47:12,009 American army base in 1980 and that one 1072 00:47:16,799 --> 00:47:14,799 looks like the lights of a vehicle the 1073 00:47:18,209 --> 00:47:16,809 story there seems to be there are some 1074 00:47:19,300 --> 00:47:18,219 cheap driving where where it shouldn't 1075 00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:19,310 have been or something 1076 00:47:26,060 --> 00:47:23,130 somebody saw it but it's all tied up in 1077 00:47:27,290 --> 00:47:26,070 military stuff in that one and I've got 1078 00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:27,300 there a lot of people claim it was the 1079 00:47:30,620 --> 00:47:28,770 lighthouse that possibly could have been 1080 00:47:32,599 --> 00:47:30,630 causing a light as well from the area it 1081 00:47:33,620 --> 00:47:32,609 was a bit inland a lighthouse it might 1082 00:47:35,540 --> 00:47:33,630 have been a lighthouse on the coast 1083 00:47:37,580 --> 00:47:35,550 flashing but i think it was i think that 1084 00:47:39,950 --> 00:47:37,590 that's what i've seen that it was a 1085 00:47:42,740 --> 00:47:39,960 lighthouse because every five seconds to 1086 00:47:43,910 --> 00:47:42,750 the second it anyway since this is the 1087 00:47:45,770 --> 00:47:43,920 typical conversation I have with these 1088 00:47:49,430 --> 00:47:45,780 guys I come up with high hey what about 1089 00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:49,440 that like I believe in any there yeah 1090 00:47:53,210 --> 00:47:51,930 well the CC I used to be UFO believer 1091 00:47:54,320 --> 00:47:53,220 when I was a kid I thought there's 1092 00:47:55,910 --> 00:47:54,330 something going on there's all these 1093 00:47:58,340 --> 00:47:55,920 stories of their face there were books 1094 00:48:00,050 --> 00:47:58,350 about it and I deliverance from a lot of 1095 00:48:03,260 --> 00:48:00,060 stuff by charles berlitz I think this he 1096 00:48:04,670 --> 00:48:03,270 did the Buddha triangle once another 1097 00:48:06,500 --> 00:48:04,680 ones are pretty good George Adamski I 1098 00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:06,510 read a few of his books and that there's 1099 00:48:09,710 --> 00:48:08,010 a guy could after shuttle wooden bitten 1100 00:48:11,810 --> 00:48:09,720 it was a local journalist on the warmest 1101 00:48:13,790 --> 00:48:11,820 two times and he had a book there was a 1102 00:48:15,620 --> 00:48:13,800 bit that he was so successful he made so 1103 00:48:17,630 --> 00:48:15,630 much money that he was able to buy his 1104 00:48:19,760 --> 00:48:17,640 own printing fists and sure of his own 1105 00:48:21,859 --> 00:48:19,770 books so there are lots of us about that 1106 00:48:23,750 --> 00:48:21,869 but some Gillick I was I was a UFO 1107 00:48:27,230 --> 00:48:23,760 believer you know a bit by bit the 1108 00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:27,240 stories pale into insignificance there's 1109 00:48:34,609 --> 00:48:29,010 evidence comes up they turn to be hoaxes 1110 00:48:36,830 --> 00:48:34,619 or not enough evidence or the friend of 1111 00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:36,840 a friend of a friend told me this and we 1112 00:48:40,250 --> 00:48:38,850 track it down there's nothing there and 1113 00:48:43,070 --> 00:48:40,260 in the end even the most famous UFO 1114 00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:43,080 sightings one by one turn to be hoaxes 1115 00:48:47,240 --> 00:48:45,210 or some kind of delusion and they are 1116 00:48:49,130 --> 00:48:47,250 actually left with nothing nothing in 1117 00:48:51,349 --> 00:48:49,140 the pot at all is there one of the 1118 00:48:53,660 --> 00:48:51,359 events or happenings that is yet to be 1119 00:48:55,640 --> 00:48:53,670 uncovered do you think still needs a bit 1120 00:48:58,190 --> 00:48:55,650 more investigation I don't know of any 1121 00:48:59,750 --> 00:48:58,200 they will go into the realm of there not 1122 00:49:02,060 --> 00:48:59,760 being off evidence or the stories are 1123 00:49:04,490 --> 00:49:02,070 too fuzzy or there's there's no good 1124 00:49:07,220 --> 00:49:04,500 photo the photos autofocus some in 1125 00:49:09,710 --> 00:49:07,230 particular there is no photo from two 1126 00:49:11,090 --> 00:49:09,720 angles of the same you phone I see if 1127 00:49:12,830 --> 00:49:11,100 something you hovered over London or 1128 00:49:14,660 --> 00:49:12,840 whatever they do if two people 1129 00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:14,670 photographed it you could see what the 1130 00:49:18,440 --> 00:49:16,290 height was and the position and 1131 00:49:20,090 --> 00:49:18,450 everything that's never happened it's 1132 00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:20,100 only only ever been one photo of the 1133 00:49:23,930 --> 00:49:22,650 thing because we are here at the club at 1134 00:49:26,270 --> 00:49:23,940 the end of the street there what you've 1135 00:49:29,060 --> 00:49:26,280 been investing all that time in recently 1136 00:49:30,500 --> 00:49:29,070 Richard oh I talked about this nullarbor 1137 00:49:35,540 --> 00:49:30,510 case because I 1138 00:49:37,370 --> 00:49:35,550 is a interviewed by a producer just 1139 00:49:39,790 --> 00:49:37,380 recently I mean he wanted to know about 1140 00:49:42,020 --> 00:49:39,800 it plus the humpty doo total hop hop 1141 00:49:44,030 --> 00:49:42,030 humpty doo what the guys say that 1142 00:49:46,010 --> 00:49:44,040 quickly so that's I spent days 1143 00:49:48,290 --> 00:49:46,020 researching both these mysterious 1144 00:49:50,390 --> 00:49:48,300 goings-on from the past now that for our 1145 00:49:52,550 --> 00:49:50,400 overseas that's great the humpty doo 1146 00:49:54,200 --> 00:49:52,560 holder guys that was that the one up in 1147 00:49:55,490 --> 00:49:54,210 the Northern Territory all right that 1148 00:49:57,980 --> 00:49:55,500 was the one that when the fam meant 1149 00:50:00,590 --> 00:49:57,990 round things happen yes and somebody was 1150 00:50:02,630 --> 00:50:00,600 caught in the reflection of a glass 1151 00:50:05,300 --> 00:50:02,640 cabinet appeared that somebody was 1152 00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:05,310 throwing things at it it dissipated 1153 00:50:08,810 --> 00:50:06,930 quickly I'll put it that way but it was 1154 00:50:13,010 --> 00:50:08,820 it was a good case and it still held up 1155 00:50:14,660 --> 00:50:13,020 by I poltergeist ghosty researchers as 1156 00:50:16,100 --> 00:50:14,670 being a classic case you know and 1157 00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:16,110 speaking of ghosts you're as an 1158 00:50:21,650 --> 00:50:19,290 interview with you in a ghost blog this 1159 00:50:23,540 --> 00:50:21,660 I think it's ghosts of Oz Ozzie and 1160 00:50:26,150 --> 00:50:23,550 you're there having a bit of a chat 1161 00:50:28,310 --> 00:50:26,160 about your history in skeptic ality and 1162 00:50:30,350 --> 00:50:28,320 I think and I can quote you they asked 1163 00:50:33,890 --> 00:50:30,360 you about me and that he said main and 1164 00:50:35,510 --> 00:50:33,900 he's not much of a skeptic or I think it 1165 00:50:38,630 --> 00:50:35,520 was something like that and I stand by 1166 00:50:40,490 --> 00:50:38,640 that statement in fact the folks in this 1167 00:50:43,250 --> 00:50:40,500 week show notes there is a link to an 1168 00:50:46,190 --> 00:50:43,260 interview with me from ghost of oz in 1169 00:50:48,230 --> 00:50:46,200 fact alex k us who we've interviewed 1170 00:50:50,540 --> 00:50:48,240 before on the show let's focus you and 1171 00:50:52,190 --> 00:50:50,550 Alex get getting some pretty hot bloody 1172 00:50:54,890 --> 00:50:52,200 arguments on facebook from time to time 1173 00:50:57,620 --> 00:50:54,900 like you know punching breaks out on 1174 00:50:59,450 --> 00:50:57,630 Facebook between you and him well you're 1175 00:51:01,580 --> 00:50:59,460 giving each other psychological wedgies 1176 00:51:04,130 --> 00:51:01,590 we we are we are but in the end of the 1177 00:51:05,720 --> 00:51:04,140 day it's fun to see him and I talked at 1178 00:51:07,190 --> 00:51:05,730 his conventions and well after we'll 1179 00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:07,200 have to try and get them becoming to a 1180 00:51:11,450 --> 00:51:09,330 skeptics ah nothing look look that would 1181 00:51:12,590 --> 00:51:11,460 be good and I really I mean I know you 1182 00:51:14,930 --> 00:51:12,600 were very uncomfortable in the room but 1183 00:51:16,460 --> 00:51:14,940 I really enjoyed at the paranormal 1184 00:51:18,170 --> 00:51:16,470 conference where they were having that 1185 00:51:19,580 --> 00:51:18,180 that UFO chat about things I thought 1186 00:51:22,370 --> 00:51:19,590 that was great it was great to be in a 1187 00:51:24,620 --> 00:51:22,380 room where people were just blending 1188 00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:24,630 these ideas go and I was loving it it 1189 00:51:28,340 --> 00:51:26,130 was really good but yeah you haven't 1190 00:51:30,350 --> 00:51:28,350 wrote you were writing stuff down your 1191 00:51:31,910 --> 00:51:30,360 pencil broke it did it and you you 1192 00:51:33,470 --> 00:51:31,920 suggested to me that we should leave 1193 00:51:35,450 --> 00:51:33,480 because he I was about to have a fit 1194 00:51:36,650 --> 00:51:35,460 you're starting to hyperventilate you 1195 00:51:39,260 --> 00:51:36,660 know when people talking about Close 1196 00:51:41,390 --> 00:51:39,270 Encounters of the sixth kind look that 1197 00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:41,400 one up folks that's when rich Richard's 1198 00:51:44,180 --> 00:51:42,690 brain is leaving the room and I thought 1199 00:51:45,890 --> 00:51:44,190 I think we need to get this guy's 1200 00:51:48,109 --> 00:51:45,900 I think we do well I think we should 1201 00:51:54,859 --> 00:51:48,119 wind up in fact I'll just pour everybody 1202 00:51:57,200 --> 00:51:54,869 another quick drink here so we mean I 1203 00:51:59,599 --> 00:51:57,210 dance oh it's mike i'm steve ellis 1204 00:52:01,400 --> 00:51:59,609 yellow clearly the CIA God is pencil and 1205 00:52:03,650 --> 00:52:01,410 put a breaking the lid halfway out there 1206 00:52:05,540 --> 00:52:03,660 hi guys who's riding ghost notes in 1207 00:52:06,859 --> 00:52:05,550 pencil would like and he could have I 1208 00:52:09,829 --> 00:52:06,869 feel or that's clearly what it was you 1209 00:52:11,660 --> 00:52:09,839 obviously got out there and so I've been 1210 00:52:14,540 --> 00:52:11,670 I'm part of the conspiracy after all you 1211 00:52:15,650 --> 00:52:14,550 although I am I am and if people wanna 1212 00:52:17,809 --> 00:52:15,660 know where I've been for the last couple 1213 00:52:20,059 --> 00:52:17,819 of weeks i have made on skip exam I've 1214 00:52:22,160 --> 00:52:20,069 been on tool with the binger boys now i 1215 00:52:23,270 --> 00:52:22,170 know we've heard Richard Dawkins on this 1216 00:52:25,819 --> 00:52:23,280 show earlier saying that they would 1217 00:52:27,589 --> 00:52:25,829 never amount to nothing and and it's 1218 00:52:29,089 --> 00:52:27,599 funny the vengaboys say the same thing 1219 00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:29,099 about Richard vol Dawkins it's just 1220 00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:31,410 uncanny it really is yeah I've been on 1221 00:52:36,079 --> 00:52:34,050 tour with them and Oh crystal waters 1222 00:52:37,910 --> 00:52:36,089 Tina cousins a whole bunch of people but 1223 00:52:39,980 --> 00:52:37,920 all the details and a few interviews are 1224 00:52:41,660 --> 00:52:39,990 there on Maynard calm that I you take 1225 00:52:43,250 --> 00:52:41,670 along to their but it's great to be back 1226 00:52:45,170 --> 00:52:43,260 here again it's created talks it's great 1227 00:52:46,579 --> 00:52:45,180 to talk the uncanny with you all it's 1228 00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:46,589 been nice to have another little mini 1229 00:52:49,579 --> 00:52:47,970 think tanks I'd like to thank steve 1230 00:52:51,829 --> 00:52:49,589 roberts dr see roberts and you may not 1231 00:52:54,140 --> 00:52:51,839 for coming along and until the next big 1232 00:52:56,720 --> 00:52:54,150 time cheers oh they're plastic lid 1233 00:53:08,689 --> 00:52:56,730 actually herd sheep another conspiracy 1234 00:53:14,459 --> 00:53:12,179 it never ends a friend starts talking 1235 00:53:15,870 --> 00:53:14,469 about his new Reiki Master and someone 1236 00:53:18,779 --> 00:53:15,880 else just posted about another 1237 00:53:21,150 --> 00:53:18,789 all-natural cancer cure that they don't 1238 00:53:22,559 --> 00:53:21,160 want you to know about as skeptics we 1239 00:53:25,049 --> 00:53:22,569 spend a lot of time trying to educate 1240 00:53:26,749 --> 00:53:25,059 and protect those around us but there is 1241 00:53:29,609 --> 00:53:26,759 a way that you can reach millions 1242 00:53:31,679 --> 00:53:29,619 guerrilla skepticism on Wikipedia is a 1243 00:53:33,319 --> 00:53:31,689 group working to keep the best skeptical 1244 00:53:36,829 --> 00:53:33,329 information at everyone's fingertips 1245 00:53:40,709 --> 00:53:36,839 join us we need writers editors 1246 00:53:43,109 --> 00:53:40,719 translators we need you to join us or 1247 00:53:46,410 --> 00:53:43,119 find out more send a facebook friend 1248 00:54:01,609 --> 00:53:46,420 request to Susan Berbick that's ger be 1249 00:54:07,349 --> 00:54:04,079 thank you for listening to the skeptics 1250 00:54:09,240 --> 00:54:07,359 are now I'm very excited in just a 1251 00:54:11,700 --> 00:54:09,250 little under two weeks something like 1252 00:54:14,549 --> 00:54:11,710 that i'll be heading out to sydney 1253 00:54:17,579 --> 00:54:14,559 airport to catch a flight to Queenstown 1254 00:54:20,460 --> 00:54:17,589 New Zealand for the New Zealand skeptics 1255 00:54:22,710 --> 00:54:20,470 conference 2016 and that's going to be 1256 00:54:25,019 --> 00:54:22,720 in the first week end of December you 1257 00:54:26,970 --> 00:54:25,029 can get more information and more 1258 00:54:31,380 --> 00:54:26,980 importantly snap up your tickets at 1259 00:54:34,670 --> 00:54:31,390 conference dot skeptics dot n Z and a 1260 00:54:37,289 --> 00:54:34,680 big shout out to all our new zealand 1261 00:54:40,410 --> 00:54:37,299 colleagues and comrades and friends over 1262 00:54:42,930 --> 00:54:40,420 there and family as some of you around 1263 00:54:44,279 --> 00:54:42,940 the world may have noticed or seen in 1264 00:54:46,079 --> 00:54:44,289 the news that there was a series of 1265 00:54:47,730 --> 00:54:46,089 earthquakes for one big earthquake and 1266 00:54:50,490 --> 00:54:47,740 lots of little tremors afterwards in New 1267 00:54:54,839 --> 00:54:50,500 Zealand in the South Island quite a bit 1268 00:54:57,599 --> 00:54:54,849 of damage done lots of lands was slips 1269 00:55:00,480 --> 00:54:57,609 and new lands created oddly enough as 1270 00:55:02,029 --> 00:55:00,490 big earthquakes sometimes do I think 1271 00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:02,039 there was a small tsunami generated 1272 00:55:06,349 --> 00:55:04,210 luckily there wasn't I think it was only 1273 00:55:08,519 --> 00:55:06,359 two people I believe only two people 1274 00:55:11,759 --> 00:55:08,529 sadly died well that's not lucky of 1275 00:55:13,529 --> 00:55:11,769 course lucky there wasn't more so a big 1276 00:55:16,380 --> 00:55:13,539 shout out to all our new zealand friends 1277 00:55:18,809 --> 00:55:16,390 and family but anyway i'll be heading 1278 00:55:21,059 --> 00:55:18,819 there for the conference where i'll be 1279 00:55:24,150 --> 00:55:21,069 giving a talk i'm not i'm not sure what 1280 00:55:25,950 --> 00:55:24,160 they want me to just yet um i might be 1281 00:55:29,279 --> 00:55:25,960 giving a couple of talks anyway i'll be 1282 00:55:30,720 --> 00:55:29,289 sure to be mentioning psychics and how 1283 00:55:32,220 --> 00:55:30,730 to do tricks and all sorts of things 1284 00:55:33,630 --> 00:55:32,230 along the way i'll be doing spoon 1285 00:55:36,630 --> 00:55:33,640 bending of course i think there's some 1286 00:55:40,289 --> 00:55:36,640 water divining involved and whatever 1287 00:55:42,569 --> 00:55:40,299 else we can get up to if you're in New 1288 00:55:46,349 --> 00:55:42,579 Zealand why not come along and be lovely 1289 00:55:48,839 --> 00:55:46,359 to meet you conference skeptics NZ 1290 00:55:51,630 --> 00:55:48,849 coming up next week's show we're going 1291 00:55:53,539 --> 00:55:51,640 to be chatting about the recent talk 1292 00:55:58,559 --> 00:55:53,549 here in Sydney in fact just last night 1293 00:56:00,390 --> 00:55:58,569 dr. Lisa Randall cosmologists physicist 1294 00:56:03,210 --> 00:56:00,400 from the United States brought out 1295 00:56:06,329 --> 00:56:03,220 courtesy of other people our friends at 1296 00:56:08,120 --> 00:56:06,339 the think inc thinking who you hear us 1297 00:56:10,230 --> 00:56:08,130 mentioning on the show from time to time 1298 00:56:12,180 --> 00:56:10,240 what I would have fun 1299 00:56:15,510 --> 00:56:12,190 night that was what a fascinating night 1300 00:56:18,150 --> 00:56:15,520 that was talked about warp bubbles this 1301 00:56:20,220 --> 00:56:18,160 was all about dark energy and dark 1302 00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:20,230 manner which she said really should be 1303 00:56:24,330 --> 00:56:22,690 called transparent matter not dark but 1304 00:56:26,340 --> 00:56:24,340 it went into all those sort of things 1305 00:56:29,700 --> 00:56:26,350 wonderful questions from the floor after 1306 00:56:32,040 --> 00:56:29,710 the talk it was a really enlightening 1307 00:56:32,940 --> 00:56:32,050 and interesting evening anyway next week 1308 00:56:35,580 --> 00:56:32,950 we're going to be covering that with 1309 00:56:38,670 --> 00:56:35,590 some interviews on the spot on the scene 1310 00:56:40,590 --> 00:56:38,680 from Maynard who was also there with his 1311 00:56:42,690 --> 00:56:40,600 microphone running around the audience 1312 00:56:46,380 --> 00:56:42,700 and thank you to our friends at think 1313 00:56:48,060 --> 00:56:46,390 ink for arranging all that also coming 1314 00:56:51,750 --> 00:56:48,070 up on the skeptics on next week we have 1315 00:56:55,560 --> 00:56:51,760 a review of a mind-body wallet fare from 1316 00:56:59,160 --> 00:56:55,570 Oh almost 20 years ago something like 1317 00:57:01,350 --> 00:56:59,170 that here in Sydney and it's good to 1318 00:57:03,330 --> 00:57:01,360 delve there's that word again delve into 1319 00:57:06,180 --> 00:57:03,340 the archives of the Australian skeptics 1320 00:57:10,140 --> 00:57:06,190 at skeptics calm today you and read 1321 00:57:13,230 --> 00:57:10,150 reports of other times about the 1322 00:57:15,780 --> 00:57:13,240 skeptical goings-on now here's a special 1323 00:57:18,510 --> 00:57:15,790 note for our friends in the melbourne 1324 00:57:19,590 --> 00:57:18,520 area and victoria coming up at the more 1325 00:57:21,330 --> 00:57:19,600 tea skeptics and i've had the pleasure 1326 00:57:25,050 --> 00:57:21,340 of speaking for the more tea skeptics a 1327 00:57:29,340 --> 00:57:25,060 number of years ago on thursday november 1328 00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:29,350 the 24th dr. angie matki from the USA 1329 00:57:34,440 --> 00:57:32,170 with her talk medical nonsense Angie 1330 00:57:37,530 --> 00:57:34,450 matki is known to skeptics and listeners 1331 00:57:40,080 --> 00:57:37,540 of course we chat to her from time to 1332 00:57:43,349 --> 00:57:40,090 time well lucky people down in Melbourne 1333 00:57:45,780 --> 00:57:43,359 you have the chance to hear dr. Andy 1334 00:57:49,410 --> 00:57:45,790 McKee in person so check out the site 1335 00:57:52,290 --> 00:57:49,420 their meetup com / Morty hyphen skeptics 1336 00:57:55,980 --> 00:57:52,300 hyphen in life and the hyphen pub I'll 1337 00:57:59,609 --> 00:57:55,990 put a link in the show notes one talk 1338 00:58:03,420 --> 00:57:59,619 well worth going to my friends dr. Angie 1339 00:58:05,280 --> 00:58:03,430 matki medical nonsense but for this week 1340 00:58:07,260 --> 00:58:05,290 this is Richard Saunders about to run 1341 00:58:10,230 --> 00:58:07,270 downstairs yet again to get a nice cool 1342 00:58:15,040 --> 00:58:10,240 glass of ice water signing off from 1343 00:58:21,230 --> 00:58:17,450 you've been listening to the skeptics 1344 00:58:24,140 --> 00:58:21,240 own podcast visit our website at wwc a 1345 00:58:27,560 --> 00:58:24,150 petting zoo TV for contacts and archive 1346 00:58:30,290 --> 00:58:27,570 of all episodes since 2008 and our 1347 00:58:32,200 --> 00:58:30,300 online store please support the skeptic 1348 00:58:35,359 --> 00:58:32,210 zone by following us on twitter at 1349 00:58:38,990 --> 00:58:35,369 skeptic zone liking us on facebook and 1350 00:58:41,150 --> 00:58:39,000 leaving a review on iTunes you can also 1351 00:58:44,349 --> 00:58:41,160 show your support by subscribing via 1352 00:58:47,120 --> 00:58:44,359 paypal for as little as 99 cents a week 1353 00:58:48,710 --> 00:58:47,130 the skeptic zone is an independent 1354 00:58:51,170 --> 00:58:48,720 production the views and opinions 1355 00:58:52,790 --> 00:58:51,180 expressed on the skeptic zone and not 1356 00:58:55,670 --> 00:58:52,800 necessarily those of australian